Water Babies, Mermaids & Mysterious Creatures | Haunted Dangerous Waters (Ep 205)

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very spooky I just sitting here waiting hello hi I just have you seen the movie um Barbarian yet me and wait have we talked didn't we okay we talked about it just to smash yes okay well I just had a barbarian moment and if for those of you who don't I'm not gonna ruin anything but I feel like okay I basically was peeing and I didn't have toilet paper and I'm wearing a jumpsuit and so I was like I need to go get toilet paper and I was like but I can't like pull my

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jumpsuit up so I was just basically like nakedly running around the apartment trying to get toilet paper and I hunched over because I thought that that would prevent anyone yeah but it would prevent anyone from the outside world seeing me and I truly like I was like Gremlin running around oh my gosh it's a barbarian but also a little bit of a Samara moment too because your hair is really long so like I can picture it just kind of being floating out in front of you it was a barbarian moment I I caught a glimpse of myself in the mirror and I was like oh you monster you monster you know one of the things I do appreciate I know that we already talked a little bit about Barbarian but my brother and I talked a lot about it when we were driving up to Vermont together for Christmas um and I do really appreciate that they cast characters in the male roles that were unexpected you know like the the person

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who classically plays a monster and a bad guy is the good guy and the person who is always the good guy is suddenly bad and I liked that it was unexpected for those two characters for those two actors I agree I agree um that movie definitely stuck with me image wise it's it's a little golem-like too bad moves about I so badly want to dress up as Gollum for Halloween you should you should you should please uh let's do it together but your Golem and I'm something completely unrelated but I've always wanted to wear a bald cap and I've been looking for moments to do that and I feel like I could be a Captain Underpants I feel like that would be a good one that's such a fun one yes I also get to wear a bald cap we're

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just two different parts of childhood I'm like were you five years old and loved poop jokes Captain Underpants were you 12 and wanted to be in Hogwarts wait no whoa wrong movie Dobby sorry that's okay they are they're like cousins Dobby you know I was picturing Gollum but I put him in Dobby's house oh okay which is wrong yes um I love those videos on Tick Tock where it's like a Harry Potter party and everyone's dressed up you know kind of cute and then there's someone dressed as Dobby coming around

Cosmo quiz questions

wait speaking of oh my gosh this is a good segue wait this is two girls one ghost oh yeah two girls and we are your ghostesses that is Corinne hi and I am Sabrina and we're we're couch City again because we are cozy and comfortable okay but you

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were talking about parties and it made me think of this I actually screenshotted it because I wanted to share it with you and ask you these questions but while I was a haunted talk of course there was a woman who posted uh her name is Ali gone away and she posted this question that was basically like hey here's a question that I have in my back pocket and everyone else should have a question like this in their back pocket where if you're at a party a dinner party and like conversation has gone dead and it's about to be awkward and you need to fill up conversation with everybody in the room to keep things going you have to have a question to ask that so her question was and I'll ask it to you and then I'll read you a few from the comment section I feel like I'm taking a cosmo quiz yes for 17 minutes 17 magazine uh okay so Ali's question I'll probably butcher it um was basically like if you die and you

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don't know how you die like it's let's just assume it's peaceful it's sudden it's bloop you're dead yeah and you zip off to wherever we go when we die and you are told you get to go back to Earth actually for five minutes okay but the rules are you cannot go visit any of your loved ones friends family anyone that you know okay so that would scare them right because you're you'd be like a dead zombie ghost and that's scary so yeah okay you just get five minutes to go somewhere on Earth that would make you feel incredibly fulfilled or somewhere that you want to go where would that be hmm okay five minutes five minutes just a quick flip but you could go see someone else like like if you don't if they don't know you like could you if they don't know you're dead yeah like could I go visit Harry Styles or something like that absolutely or Kesha get arrested like TMZ is like

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crazed woman outside of the gates of Harry Styles home and your family's like watch though and then okay you should you can't be honest you can't make yourself be on TV okay thank you that's a good follow-up question okay clear you can't break into the White House or something well that's okay so that's my question is do you need to get access to this place or in the five minute bloop you just get to go wherever you want and there's no like rules in terms of access why are you going to Area 51 laughs maybe that's a good one that's a good one I yeah well because honestly like I'm already dead if I yeah like what do I have to lose okay well where would you choose assuming that you did have to gain access like assuming that you have all the same

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access that you do right now Sabrina because Sabrina is where would you go probably like a cat shelter yeah that's good hopefully wherever you go when you die also has cats and animals and all that good stuff that is um a mandatory requirement um yeah you know I was more what would you do well I was thinking more I think you're you're thinking like oh how do I see all the answers to the universe or spend extra time with the things that I love like cats but in my mind I was like all those things will be all those answers and things will be wherever I'm going so I was thinking more of like you know I'm very scent oriented so I was just trying to think of places that I would go that would just be like incredibly calm and I'd get like all of the sensory overload that I want and would remind me of my life on Earth so I was thinking of two places either I

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would go in Stowe Vermont I'd go up on Mount Mansfield up at the top where it smells like Pine and Cedar and just like like all the dead needles and leaves on the ground and it smells so good and then I would get to just look at Vermont that's really nice five minutes and then I was also thinking Lake Champlain because double whammy like Champlain champ I spent my life yeah like being bopping around like being so peaceful taking in the lake and just floating on my little boat or mine so you want peace and serenity I want peace and serenity but I get to double dip on Lake Champlain because I could also see champ that's true okay though wouldn't okay this also brings up see this is why you can't ask me questions like this at a party because then you're stuck in a conversation for like eight hours this is the point though it's like you don't want the party to end I know but people would be like okay Sabrina you're taking this far too seriously like this

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is supposed to be a fun question and now you're like pontificating yeah what are the exact rules my follow-up question is like okay what does the afterlife look like because that also changes what the answer does it does I don't think I don't think you get to know you just have to make a decision I want answers I'll ask you a few oh yeah go ahead okay my question and this is like and I've done this I think just out of like nerve neuroses like I was just like nervous and like didn't know what to do um I've like asked like so how would you kill someone if you had to kill someone how would you get rid of the body that reminds me of when our friend Ally were you in the car with Ali when she called me one time no it was Lauren Lauren and Ally they were in a car with someone else but Ali called me and I picked up and I was like hi what's going on and she was like I have a question

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for you if you were to dispose of a body how would you do it and I just paused and I said is there someone else in the car with you and she just started laughing and the whole car started laughing because the point was like that they thought no no yeah and I was like I can't if I don't know the other person in the car I can't yeah yourself yeah and also that's like you can't share the secrets with everyone also this is another yeah good one too to your to your point of like asking those wild questions the comment section

Conspiracy theories

of this post was hilarious but someone wrote Kate Wells 25 wrote that their nephew at Christmas asked what conspiracy theory or unsolved mystery do you believe in which is such a good one to ask people because I feel like you you'd be surprised by some people's answers right that is a good one what's your answer Bigfoot all of them one of the wrong people to ask this one I'm more curious what like a regular

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person's answer would be what is a regular person I don't think I surround myself around regular people yeah I think Hmm I think a conspiracy theory that I I really truly believe in to some extent well no not to some extent I do believe in mermaids like I think that there are some sort of creature I don't know that they look like women with I mean we already know this I did a whole episode where I was like I believe but I don't know I think that there's something there's there's something in the water that's different than what we know to be like what currently looks like there's so much nefarious malevolent creatures yeah you know what about the weirdest dream this is such a tangent uh okay well I believe in everything as well

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um I'll go back to my tangent in a second I just wanted to answer your question um let's see it's like a really big conspiracy that I believe in I think you told me this but like I do believe some birds are fake oh wait this reminds me I just went to the Museum of Science last weekend and there's an exhibit where they they show different like historical variations of technology and film and cameras and they had a what looked like a pigeon with a camera on its back and it was just supposed to represent how they would hook cameras two pigeons but it took me like a good two minutes because my mind was like oh my God in the museum of science they're literally telling us that birds aren't like there are birds that aren't

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real like that's I thought that the like model was actually their robot bird I was like Wow but I mean there's got I'm sure there's some security cameras out there right that look very bird-like gotta be but birds as a whole are not are real yes yes just um thank you for clarifying I don't believe the entire bird population because if they were they would be yeah exactly that would be like why'd you put so much effort into creating so many different types of birds Just Right to make them cameras like come on and also another big problem like if if you're trying to get rid of all of the birds that exist and replace them all with robots you also would have to do something about the cat population because people would find out because cats go after Birds right there's a lot of animals that would present to a lot of people

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who you don't want knowing your secret your secret so don't touch the birds because we can't touch the cats especially get the perfect I'm beautiful because the cats are I agree my damn one more question for you oh the tangent I was gonna go on is I've been having such wild dreams that I like I've I've started a dream journal because they are so have you like I remember such detail lately and I think it's probably just everything I'm going through but they are so Vivid and it's also like it's it's very I'll explain one it's not gonna make sense really but I basically was um gosh this is it's so hard to explain dreams because like I feel like it just makes sense and you hadn't even visually see it but anyway I wish we could record there in the morning that would be so cool I know it would be

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helpful one of my dreams there was like um like a speakeasy like Diner place that like I was trying to go up into but I was wearing my big combat boots that are really heavy and the stairs were really skinny and I couldn't get it up the stairs and it was really frustrating finally I get up the stairs and we're like sitting down for dinner and all of a sudden like there's this like conspiracy of like the these like murders that are happening and there's like a group of women who supposedly are committing them and I go up to the bathroom and I'm in the bathroom and a police officer like burst in and I'm in the stall so I'm like kind of like no one sees me and the police officer Burson and there are these two women and he was like I know who you are and they they kill him and I don't know I end up like getting out and I see these girls and they're fairies like it's very much like sirens of um like in Wednesday wow I'm trying to this is a Sci-Fi murder mystery yes and I'm trying to tell everyone that this table of women who's

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like sitting there are all the murderers but they're like staring at me and giving me a look and like very much like oh we're gonna get away with this anyway I believe in fairies is is the tangent that I was going on oh yeah I believe in fairies too I almost I mean that's an amazing dream Sabrina and part of me wanted to stop you while you were retelling it to say like hey you should just make this into a show like don't don't tell everyone just keep it keep it and write it I feel like sometimes so many of our dreams give us all the best ideas and yes that that and things that you say Karen no yes my word vomit okay well one last question for you Sabrina and maybe this will give you actually no two more questions okay there's some good ones and then we'll get to go stories yeah

Extroverted vs introverted

All Out of Milk said if you were going about your normal day how many owls would you need to see before you thought

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something was wrong two two final answer yeah yeah I feel like two two is good I think I'd maybe need to see three I don't know I I haven't even had a day where I've seen one like unless I'm like out in the wilderness so I think two would definitely and especially you know we've heard of and I don't want to say the word but the entities that present as owls I think I would upon seeing the first owl I would immediately go there and then if I saw a second owl I'm also picturing it like in Harry Potter when you go outside and like the owl's just like sitting on the top of your car like that I'm picturing it being that close to me oh yeah I like The Fourth Kind where it's just in your window still staring at you before you get abducted

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see I would like that the final question for you is and this is a Ariella but quarantined asked this if you had to hide a giraffe from the government where would you put it where would you put it I want to hear your answer I don't know I haven't thought of an answer to that I'm just scrolling right now if you had a hide a giraffe from the government um okay well now I'm gonna get too Nitty Gritty about this but I was alive to hide a giraffe I want to go put it into the wild you have to play the game you have to play the game and it's not a dead body draft that you can just bury well I don't want to do that either um okay I think I would hide it in my backyard which I don't have but in this scenario I have a

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backyard and I plant really tall trees where would you put it and that's it I don't know I mean my brain then just goes to put a giraffe in the bathtub and I just like want to take a bath with a giraffe and that feels like a children's book right and if you hide it in a body of water then people are gonna think it's a lake monster right because it's heavy coming out it's very serpent-like perhaps your idea could work if you put it in a secluded backyard with a lot of tall trees and then you painted it in some sort of camouflage to make it look like the foliage that's around it this is just reminding me when we were in South Africa my favorite photos are the ones where there's a bunch of tall trees and all of a sudden there's just a little like giraffe head sticking out of the top the two little Nubs their little antenna yeah what are those even for do you know did you learn what are the Nubs on the top

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of drafts Gus did tell us and now I'm blanking and I think the technical term is Nubs you are correct because that is scientifically correct oh God I love those nubby little traps the little knobs well this is gonna become a nature podcast eventually we'll get there yeah I don't even know what this became I mean this kind of just became the uh quiz questionnaire episode yeah well um everyone think of what your question would be oh this is good and if you're on our YouTube or if you're looking on Instagram WE Post and say hello this is our new episode right down right down what your question would be that's a good idea that helps everyone else have a list of questions you won't even just have friends one prepared you'll have a whole bunch of questions ready to go yeah great it's very it's a great idea

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this is a good and I'm extroverted until I'm not so it would it's helpful for me too introverted as hell so yeah I don't think that I don't think that about you Sabrina I think you're like you're like me like you you could talk and conversate with people and like be a life of a party for 90 minutes and then maybe six minutes yeah but I've seen it I've seen it from you that's why like 90 minutes is short I feel like I've seen you go for longer you have been like a mentally blackout and I have to sleep for 10 days um but I think what it has to do with more is how you recharge and I get way more drained being around a bunch of people yeah I agree with that yeah extroverted introverts social introverts yeah I like people it's like sometimes

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if if you have a Saturday Fray what do you do do you reach out to people to hang out well maybe this is just getting too much into yeah depression because I'm real I'm like in the summertime yeah I would but then in the winter I'm like well just sit at home alone well let's just just I just want to make note of where my brain is when you said let's just say it's a Saturday I heard let's just say it's a sad day hahaha and if you can see the bag is under my eyes there's been a lot of them hmm no it's okay it's good we're good you know what growth and yes okay okay into the research of the week

The water babies legend

I do want to provide a Content warning up front that this episode contains graphic content not suitable for some audiences I do mention uh the description of child death in parts of their story

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okay alrighty okay emigrants of the Oregon Trail we used to play the game when we were in middle school but for a lot of people that was real life and really scary and dusty and dirty and threatening to their lives and there's a place on the Oregon Trail that these people called the Gate of death the terrain there is Jagged it's these big boulders the trails are very winding and tight so as I'd be going around they'd have a lot of blind spots they don't always know what they're going to come up into and and have to defend themselves against or are they gonna drop off a cliff you know there's a lot a lot of scary Terrain in this area and difficult terrain if you're thinking about how people would travel on these like wagons for thousands of miles right yeah it's like their entire life's

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like supplies everything like everything alone their kids family members yeah exactly yes and this was a place the gate of death that reminded them of just how alone and vulnerable they really were it is where danger lurks this place is Massacre rocks and it is now known as Massacre Rocks State Park in Idaho and there's an urban legend in this area which is really what this episode is going to be about and it's one that's equally tragic and frightening it is the legend of water babies um we've mentioned water babies or we've had a listener mention them once yeah and I always get them confused with Melon Heads Melon Heads were the legend of the

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melonheads were of these children that had escaped some sort of horrible Hospital School like testing situation right yeah yeah and then lived in the woods basically okay that their heads were melon shaped or it was like a horrible name to remind people of the deformities that these children had based on the horrific like testing that had been done on them right so Melon Heads that Legend is in the woods and it is on land I guess water babies there's a few variations of this Legend and we'll talk about it but first we're going to talk about the massacre uh State rocks version of water babies

Historical context

okay so centuries ago the native people who lived in the area were thrown a terrible Challenge from Mother Nature and that was that there was a horrible famine so people were starving to death

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it was really serious and this wasn't just like a one growing season sort of situation where everybody has to get through one year and then it's going to be better this was a multi-year issue for people and so people's lives were extremely threatened from the land that they had spent centuries and centuries and really thought there's evidence of people the native people being here for thousands of years and so now they are faced with this horrible situation where so much of their land is is destroyed and it's not good for growing crops and and farming and hunting and whatnot so there wasn't enough food for everyone the elders were starving parents were starving children were starving people were dying and so it is said in the legend that people gathered together and discussed what they could do how they could possibly survive through the year of constant starvation they were all terribly weak they were sick and the

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threat of any new mouths to feed really worried everyone and so they made an impossible decision this is where I'm going to give the trigger warning the content warning for infant death it was decided by everybody in the group that rather than willingly bring children into the world only for them to be starved and in pain and die soon after because that's what would happen they would die the babies were to be returned to the spirit world once they came here and once this decision was made it was said to be enforced and mothers were made to walk their babies to the river and to end their child's hunger once and for all this is real this is a legend okay this is a legend yeah I'll remind everyone this is a legend okay this is there's no evidence of this happening there's evidence truly of a drought or not sorry not of a drought but of this starvation period yes famine but

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there is not any evidence of this happening to any of the kids but this is this is like the oral history okay this goes back to your question of like believing in conspiracies and do you believe like we both said we believe in all of them this is a legend I hoped I don't want to believe in right and it's also I mean it's horrible right like you don't want to think about that ever happening to anybody yeah but it's also understandable how something like that could come if in oral histories you know people are talking about something that scares them or a time period in their life where it was just like so completely atrocious that a lot of these stories do have some Fear Factor to them right like you have to add in some horrific things because it felt horrific going through it and you want to warn the like next Generations of what could possibly happen but this this is a legend so okay thank you for clarifying yes

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okay so basically it it was said in this legend that for many years this is what happened because until they could begin to if you feed themselves enough they would not feed new mouths and so no new children were able to join this world uh in that community and so the legend of water babies was born at least here it was right because babies whose Spirits uh were released to the river then were said to imprint on the land and the water and it said that if you sit on the bank of Snake River in maska Rock State Park so it's this River that's it goes through the park it's not super long either um or at least that stretch of it if you sit there on the bank that you will hear babies crying the residual stain and a reminder of just how devastating life was all those years ago

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so a horrific beginning to the water babies Legend but I will say I put this at the top so that we could get it over with because the re the rest of the water babies legends from various areas in the United States is a is a lot uh creepier I guess it's not as sad so I just wanted to get the the sad part out first thank you okay so perfect beginning but just a reminder that is an urban legend there are absolutely there's no physical or like written evidence that that is what happened to these kids yeah so but a legend thank you okay um I also want to note that in this period that water babies were born or they're said to have been born this Legend here at Massacre Rocks State Park there was a period of several years where there was uh starvation and famine

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in the 1800s white settlers were hunting on traveling on and destroying native people's land so basically the Oregon Trail was extremely destructive as well yeah like all of that migration to the west and really all all of the Americas but uh it really was affecting everybody and so suddenly the land was not destroyed because of anything with seasonal changes or really Mother Nature it was the people that were destroying this land and sending this group into a multi-year period of starvation Yep this is why humans are the the monsters the real monsters oh my gosh again when I was at the Museum of Science there were certain certain uh exhibits that I was looking at and I was literally like oh my God humans are such parasites like it was yeah scary to see some of the changes I think I was going through like the animal Extinction exhibit and I was just

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like oh God it's hard to look at yeah it is okay but to the native people to the Shoshone people this led to years of hunger and struggle and then in January of 1863 the U.S army massacred hundreds of Shoshone tribal members those who survived were relocated and lived many more years in famine and were exposed to Dune diseases and this event was called The Bear River Massacre can I make a note real quick you did this whole like little like Preamble of I got the sad stuff over with in the beginning and Dove directly into a more tragedy and more tragedy I should have said that two paragraphs from where I said it yeah very sorry I'm very sorry we're gonna we're gonna you know I have like five more paragraphs actually that's gonna be sad and then we're gonna get into some creepier stuff but yeah I mean like it's just even more backstory of like that's

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what actually happened in this area so you can see why all of these Legends and and oral histories became because obviously it's tragic and it's scary and there was a lot of people that died a lot of we can presume a lot of babies that were extremely sick too right and like children young children getting these diseases that they've never been exposed to before and yeah passing away so it's it's awful and obviously the U.S involvement was crazy and I just want to say I want to also go add another like side tangent that when I was writing down the dates like okay 1863 that's when the Bear River Massacre happened where all of these people were murdered by the by the US Army it just kind of made me stop and think about how long ago that actually was and it wasn't like I feel like we always talk about these things that happened in our past like oh wow they're so far away from us so far removed in

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history like we're past that now we're so much better and that was I mean when this happened that's like what that's like our our Grandma's Grandma was probably alive at that point right yeah it's so wild and also just it reminds me or doesn't really remind me but it makes me more Curious of epigenetics and just sort of like how cells have memories and how things like that affect our DNA because that's that's an ancestor that's not that far away from yeah us today like passed on family traumas yes yes yeah I mean we've talked about this stuff so much and so much of our podcast too are are things that we're like oh this happened 150 years ago but like generationally that's not that long ago and so yeah and it just feels disconnected from us because Our Lives relative to that have been

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much shorter yes yes but it made me realize you know all this stuff is still living in many of us many people okay but but tangent aside

Evolved legends

uh there is another version of this urban legend from the same area so from Snake River and Massacre Rock State Park that says that this didn't actually happen to the Shoshone people so the I mean obviously the starvation and famine that's that's accurate but urban legend wise it's saying that there were no babies brought to the river but rather this happened to a group of white settlers on the Oregon Trail and this because this area was like factually a popular spot for people to to travel through and to head towards because they got some reprieve right like the it was a little bit treacherous and tar in terms of the terrain but then they got to post up at Snake River take their time

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eating fishing like refiguring things out doing their laundry like it was a spot that was generally a safe stop for them yes so there were many people who passed through this area and so it's it's thought that um perhaps this happened to a family there and that's kind of what triggered this story because although it was a great place for people to stop and take a little break the conditions obviously weren't great I mean for anyone essentially backpacking unprepared backpacking is basically what the Oregon Trail was like it's going to be it's going to be difficult and there were a lot of other um white settlers who were headed west that took advantage of the other people that were going in that direction too and started to ambush people and Rob them and people were murdered there were a

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lot of diseases and so it's thought that this could have happened to a a group of people of white people who were heading west but it's also likely the urban legend stemmed from just how many diseases and illnesses children faced both the Shoshone people and all the settlers during that time period yep the urban legend if we remember Oregon Trail it was almost impossible to get to the end or to win that game because you pretty much every time died of dysentery yeah almost every single time right there's um a couple years ago in a like a white elephant I won there's like a board game version of it basically oh and Nick and I were super excited to play it and I'm not kidding when like the first card we pulled we both died and we were like okay and then we we're like we're like

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we probably just did this wrong and we tried to do it again and like the second card we pulled we died and we're like this isn't fun it's not a fun yeah maybe not a fun board game right because it's like yeah you're most likely gonna die it's more supposed to be like a lesson that you learn on your on your old early 2000s computer that you're playing at school or whatever and then the little pixelated thing is like died of dysentery yeah the graphics make it yeah yep okay so the urban legend goes further to explain that these babies that were submerged into the water didn't actually pass away here so this is an another version from the same area rather they morphed into something else entirely so in Snake River these infants bodies changed they adapted to their environment very very quickly they started growing uh fins and gills which allowed them to live in the water and

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the water babies would hunt small fish and they would survive off an area of land which wasn't being so generous to their their families at the time and so they were almost better off in the water and just as people today believe that they hear babies crying on the bank of The River's Edge of the bank of Snake River people have also reported seeing these water babies in this fish-like state with their gills and their fins moving through the water playing in the river and venturing into the canals in the area whoa that's a laser twist right yeah they're like enjoying their time with each other yeah just playful little it reminds me almost of um otters river otters how they just play together they're so cute they're so cute and I feel like that's what water babies are yeah I'm also imagining mandrakes um like I'm kind of picturing that like little weeds grow out of them you know like the water weeds and

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they like get plucked from The Roots I don't know that's just where my brain went yeah yeah I mean I used to think about them playful and giggle laughing and having a good time in the water rather than hearing the Cries From the the yeah the bang because the the crisis so sad and heart-wrenching but it's also horrifying just from a perspective of you and I doing this podcast for five years and hearing the amount of horrifying stories and the amount of times that the crying baby is not actually a crying baby right so yeah I know and it just I mean it begs the question that we've asked before which is like how do you know what Cryptid or creature is is trying to lure you in right or is it a haunting is it some of the other things that we should name you know La Llorona like who who is

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it who is calling to you what is this it's hard because there are so many so many examples yeah water babies though are not exclusive to Snake River in fact water babies are a big part of western Native American folklore and tribes believe water babies are able to inhabit Springs streams ponds rivers and lakes basically wherever there's water there could be water babies interesting and so they could be in the ocean baby mermaids you might be on to something okay

Malevolent sirens

I kind of think that they're mermaids too yeah and you'll see why okay so we already so we we're moving on from Snake River and Massacre Rocks State Park okay so we're we're going to another region and the the lore with water babies is going to be a little bit more cryptid-esque as we move forward

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so three and a half hours south we are now in Utah which I really want to go to have never been but water babies take on too much have you so yeah Salt Lake City Salt Lake City and um you've been to more than one place and you just said that you've never been what's the um why am I blinking on the ski town oh don't quiz me oh my gosh they even have like a film festival why am I blanking oh um it's where Sundance is Sundance wear sundances I don't know I can't remember hey wait I need to I need to we need to answer this Park City Park City Utah there we go okay well we're we're not near Park City but we are right below Salt Lake City on Utah Lake

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the native Ute people told of creatures in the water these creatures were a population of dwarves who lived in the water underwater and the youth people referred to them as water babies so these creatures are very similar to Sirens so basically very mermaid-esque maybe baby mermaids way interesting that I had this nightmare about siren fairies and perhaps it was me uh having some type of deja vu about your story premonition yeah for today yeah maybe the water babies are trying to warn you not to talk about them and now look at us and now look at us 45 minutes and here's the thing we've done this so many times we've attempted fate a little too much and I feel like water babies were a little bit on the safer end in terms of creatures we're probably not supposed to talk about yeah yeah yeah but these siren-esque creatures uh live to be very

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malevolent and they want to wish people harm who wander too far into their Waters so now if you're thinking well just don't go to the water then that's hard to avoid all water it's hard to avoid all water and also I have news for you these creatures just like mermaids just like the siren Call they have a call of their own and it is the sound of a crying baby but better way to get someone to the water's edge and looking then to be looking for a baby yeah so people do Venture a little too far hearing the cries of unseen infants and people rush to the shore walk into the water wait out in the middle middle searching for the source of the sound searching to save a baby it's just so sad because it's like these people are being Good Samaritans and trying to help

45:00

only to be manipulated and learned into a I mean I don't know what happens but sounds like a dangerous situation yeah and it's reminding me a little bit of um oh gosh what's that what's that uh show where they go back in time in the Rock and Ireland no oh um Outlander Outlander remember when she finds the baby in the woods do you remember that scene and the baby unfortunately yeah it's crying and she gets there a little too late to save it because the people thought that it was like the the troll or whatever had had uh planted its own baby for them to take care of and it is just so sad but it's like yeah this stuff is all baby cries it's it's uh it's a tough thing because everything in your body says go help the baby and almost every

46:00

time you should go help the baby but um in war like this if you did that it was a mistake yeah we're not saying don't help the babies that we should clarify help please help the babies please help the babies but also bring a friend too right just to be as safe as possible so hearing the cries of these unseen infants people do wander into the water and then unfortunately for many people they are caught by something caught by what is called a water baby this nefarious water being who grabs hold of them and drags them down into the depth of the water to their death you know what I kind of like about that is that it's like reverse fishing we as humans fish and kill creatures in the water and I like that these water babies babies are like um

47:00

we're gonna just change the narrative real quick and give you a taste of your own medicine they hunt us and then the baits Hunters right like they don't need to string a little worm onto a hook for us they just need to mimic a baby's cries you're onto something okay so there's one more body of water

Pyramid Lake curse

in the United States that also has creatures that locals refer to as water babies in Nevada Pyramid Lake it has been known to swallow men whole so for years there have been fishermen that have just simply vanished while fishing out on the lake and I did look up disappearances and and deaths on Pyramid Lake and this like I mean this place has got to be dangerous because there are so many articles because I was thinking I went into the research being like Oh I'm gonna get a solid answer of like 15

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people have gone missing since 2005. no there's just so many articles of police need help searching for missing woman searching for a missing man searching for like there's so many people who capsize in their boats I was gonna ask is it like a Leisure Lake or is it like because you said fisherman so is it yeah because I feel like lakes in general are really dangerous there's a lot of boating accidents a lot of things like that but it sounds like it's it's the later it's latter later it's a little bit of a Leisure Lake yeah like I mean they have all of the normal Lake activities in the summer and then in the in the winter when it's too cold to go into the water it's mostly Fisher fishermen that are out there it's mostly used for fishing um but people vanish on the lake and sometimes people are recovered but a lot of the times bodies are not recovered and so I was just curious I was like okay well how are bodies not recovered

49:00

like what could happen for a body to not be recovered because most bodies float right so I did a little bit of research and the reason that human bodies do float is because of bacteria so when someone drowns or dies underwater their lungs fill up with water so it replaces all of the air in our lungs and the bacteria in our guts and our in our chest cavity will then produce gases so like we've sunk with the water filling up our lungs and then all the bacteria if it's at the right temperature will grow and produce these gases and carbon dioxide methane hydrogen sulfide which will essentially expand our bodies make us like a little balloon and Float us up to the surface so interesting isn't it yeah because people sink and then it was like well what made them resurface and it's literally bacteria but bacteria has to be at a certain temperature to be able to right grow which is why some people are never recovered because depending on the

50:00

temperature of a body of water if something if a place stays extremely cold year round their body may never rise to the surface um I had that in mind and so I looked up pyramid Lake's temperature and right now we're in the dead of winter when this we're in January and the temperatures are in the 40s and 50s in the water so it's not cold enough for bodies to not float to the surface okay then again there's a lot of other factors to take into consideration like currents underwater because lakes also have currents um vegetation at the bottom that could have gotten people caught up and just in general there's other animals that exist and could be eating people as well so there's what else is there the reasons for people to not resurface but probably the biggest reason is because of water babies of

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course babies um I do want to just put it a note that if you plan to go to this Lake it is strongly strongly advised by officials to wear life jackets and to be cautious because there just really are a lot of accidents on this Lake but it is said that the reason that so many people go missing and never resurface is because water babies are present and they are the ones to blame they are angry Spirits in Pyramid Lake of sick babies who were brought to the water their lives ended and now for centuries these water babies have been plucking people from above bringing them down into the depths of the dark Lake never to resurface plucking people from above locking them there's another variation of Pyramid Lake water babies that states something entirely different in this portion of the legend is that there was a native Paiute man so

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the Peyote people are the Native American group that lives right or lived live still lives in The Pyramid Lake area and so there was a Paiute band at Pyramid Lake and he happened upon the most beautiful woman he had ever laid eyes on my God she was striking and she happened to be laying out right by the water's edge so he looks at her and he kind of you know gives checks her out goes from the top down to the bottom see what you're broken with and where he expected to see legs he saw a fishtail I like to imagined yeah definitely mermaid but I like the the fact that he's so struck by her beauty that the last thing he notices is the absence of legs and replacement of tail because of the first thing

53:00

yes that's a good point but maybe is it even being struck by that person's view or I'm calling them a person that mermaid's beauty or is it one of the things that Sirens it's almost like a black-eyed kid right like people look at them and don't realize for a couple minutes that their eyes are actually fully blacked out there's something in the little spell that keeps you from seeing the whole picture for a little bit yeah it's also kind of you know how when things are spelled incorrectly our brains automatically correct it like it's it's probably a little bit of a our brain sees what it wants to see or what it expects to see which actually reminds me I should have done this at the top of the episode but I did not our listener and reached out because for the entire episode that I did two weeks ago when I talked about the Robinson family murders I misspoke the entire time it is Robeson there is no n

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and so I'm going to correct that because I feel awful that I talked about that poor family for 90 minutes and did couldn't even say their name correctly so thank you Ann for pointing that out yes but yes our brains do make jumps that aren't always things sexual in there and it does change things I also wish just to keep going for a minute I wish that you know how when there's like a Riptide or there's a shark in the water we have lifeguards that that scream out and alert people or put up Flags I wish for mermaids that there was some variation of that like wouldn't it be so cool if you were just hanging out on the beach and then there was a siren that was like alert mermaid alert mermaid that means yes okay in South Africa they have I have a picture of it but you know how like instead of so we usually have lifeguards on the beach in South Africa they have shark Watchers who are up in

55:00

the like Hills above the ocean above the beaches and they truly sit out there for the entirety of the day watching for sharks and then they have like a radio that they can call down to the beach to be like hey there are sharks that's so smart because how are you ever supposed to see a shark from Shore it's so hard you really know more of an aerial view aerial view yeah but I've spent a lot of time in the shallows too which is really scary because that's like literally where we are when we go into the water but like doing that job would have I feel like the pressure would be so high to and and they're alone it's not like there's two of you to have like you know double check your work it's you're alone by yourself for hours at a time which probably is boring because you're just scanning the waters and most of the time you're probably not going to see

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anything but what about that five minutes where you just get a little distracted and all of a sudden a shark comes and you're like ah right I know and then also just like looking at the same thing the whole time I'm sure it would be hard to actually trust that you're seeing what you think you're saying or to even see something at all right because like things start to go if you stare at a wall long enough like I feel like it starts to move and there's like more colors and it's just like how do you even see it at that

Shape-shifting entities

point the patterns are just all over the place I also wonder what kind of vision test you need to do in order to get that job um yeah they should just start using drones right just everybody look with a drone right over the water get real close okay Okay so this Paiute man he sees this woman so beautiful then realizes she's a tail does that matter to him no no he's in love She's So Beautiful

57:00

so knowing what we know about the classic siren story we can probably assume that he was under some sort of spell but he does bring this person mermaid lady back to his tribe and he wants to make her his wife how so excited she has no life oh that was a great question because I also was curious about that and I could not find any variation that was like here's how she got back there like did she do the worm the whole way there did he carry her did she float did she grow did she give her voice away to Ursula to have legs yes we we don't know we don't know it does not it does not say but to him everything was fantastic there clearly were no big red flags and he just thought yep

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I can definitely marry this marvelous woman so he brings her back to the tribe and is like Hello everybody guess who I found the love of my life at the water's edge my my wife I knew you were gonna say that oh gosh and everybody else is Not underneath these the spell the sirens song and so they're like what the hell what kind of creature did you just bring back from the lake to where we all live and expose basically like our whole community and so they're like no no take her back and so he does he can't be ostracized from his community I guess the spell doesn't work that strongly and so he brings this mermaid person back to Pyramid Lakes Waters Edge and uh his prospective mermaid wife must return to the lake he won't bring her back to his tribe and she's livid she's like how dare you bring me back to where you

59:00

found me this is not part of my plan so she did want out she wanted out but okay why we do not know all we know is she was so mad that whatever her plan was was foiled enough for her to curse the lake so the lake is now going to pose a threat to all of the native people and the curse showed its face not long after this fish woman was returned from the man's tribe so he returns back and he's like oh my God she did not take that well and it was cursed and they know it to be cursed because not long after a baby was possessed oh but not by just a typical old demon that we know of this baby was possessed by a water spirit that morphed into a snake and this baby now a snake lunged at its own mother latching its fangs onto her skin and refusing to let go and then an

1:00:00

elastic effort to save this woman because everybody could not detach this woman from her snake baby the local healer in the group came and was like demon I will make a deal with you and so he basically proposed to this snake baby water spirit that if it lets go of this poor woman then they would agree that Pyramid Lake was the demon could take it the spirit could take it Pyramid Lake belongs to them and according to Legend the demon accepted and the lake still is very much theirs wow some deal with a demon deal with a demon can you also Imagine just your child morphing into not only being possessed but like being possessed into a whole nother reptilian like creature and attacking you it reminds me of like

1:01:00

Greek gods and goddesses like a bit of story where he totally attacked you know the snakes were put into his bed um yeah it's I cannot imagine um actually I imagine that that's something my brain would create in my dreams but in I can't imagine having that happen in real life right well and now it's going to make me think like we brought up like Champlain and champ earlier and so I mean I totally believe in champ and I totally believe that there are these species of creatures I don't believe them to be Cryptids but just like actual animals yeah that are undiscovered but this is making me wonder if like what if there are just these water spirit creatures that do appear as snakes sometimes and take on that shape and that's sometimes what people are seeing in the water and then we think that there's a big monster in the water but really it's just how this

1:02:00

entity is choosing to present itself at the moment yeah I mean that's the scary thing about dark entities is they historically have the ability to show up as anything which I'm kind of jealous of like I want to be a shape-shifter and I also want to be able not that I want to curse people necessarily but I want to have the ability to just curse people like that that seems cool you just want to be powerful you want to feel so protected that you're it doesn't matter what someone does to you you're like you better watch yourself because I continue way worse yeah I guess I just I just want to be a witch so yeah ah what a dream we could be we just need to unlock our power let's see some will say that these pyramid-like water baby Legends have been around for centuries others say that this Legend is new it's

1:03:00

just an urban legend that came basically with the internet like so many others but also I'm like I think that this is probably some oral history that's been passed down for a long long time by the many many native tribes in the Western United States um so it's not new some people think it is so while many people may not believe in the story and legends of water babies I'm sure visitors and locals can agree on this that occasionally by the water's edge at Pyramid Lake and all those other lakes that I was talking about in rivers you may just hear the Phantom cries of a baby or the joyful laughter of unzeen children nearby are these noises evidence of some demonic reptilian creature masquerading as a human infant or is it simply a trick of sound perhaps the wind carrying a baby's cries over the lake from across the way we can only hope that we don't come across such a thing as many tribal Traditions mourn The Cry of a baby is an

1:04:00

omen of death not water babies that is so fascinating I know and and also just I mean it goes back to like it's sad that the cries of babies can be a bad Omen like I it just um you don't want to think that I know but it's also I mean it kind of makes sense if you think about how animals adapt and like we are animals and we could be prey to many other creatures out there but I'm just thinking about like all of the other animals out there that do certain things whether it be for mating or just for food where they trick other species other creatures to come towards them so that they can

1:05:00

eat them murder them you know like there's a lot of mimicry in nature so much yeah and babies cries are like the the thing that can be mimicked for humans like what else could be mimicked that humans will yeah I mean neatly come forward and follow the sound up I mean that's like ice cream truck that's about it cats even mimic babies cries in their purse it's the same like um wavelengths because it like it triggers something within us as humans to to care for them also on the ice cream truck I think during our childhood ice cream trucks and the ice cream man started to get a really bad rep that I um was terrified of the ice cream truck oh you were

1:06:00

I I had some pure joy about it for a period of time and then it turned into and it wasn't just the ice cream truck anytime a car drove past my home I hid behind bushes like a lot of this is the fault of our parents stranger danger because some parents and I think my mom did too went a little too hard on Stranger Danger at points where it really does traumatize you it's like you want your kids to be safe by warning them against the dangers but each child is different and how they perceive the warning is going to be different and you can't always like it might you might just think that you're innocently being like hey the person that that drives by in a car doesn't necessarily live in our neighborhood so you have to be on high alert still and like don't go up to people's cars we don't know them and then to a child they might be like oh my God there's murderers driving down the street like

1:07:00

you never know how kids are gonna take it in I remember that that does scare you yeah a Berenstein Bears book about stranger danger and I don't even remember the contents of it but I think my mom read it to me enough where it just yeah I I very much I think this goes back to like I have a very you you too like have a very like wild vivid imagination and we take it to extremes that are often on the darker end of the spectrum so I yeah I often as a young kid dream dreamed of being kidnapped of being stolen from my bed from being of being murdered and you know a young kid should not have to uh imagine those things yeah yeah I had the the same thing happen and then as soon as I flew the coop as soon as I moved out of

1:08:00

my parents house because what my mom did she bought me the book The Gift of fear which was just another reminder like dangers out there trust your instincts don't be ignoring anything yeah yeah hey they kept us alive it did so far we've made it this far yep that's good now we get it you can tell stories so I could not find a story specifically about water babies so I was like okay water babies kind of fall under the Cryptid uh category so I found a story from our listener Laura and it is called bear question mark moose butt question mark big foot question mark Bigfoot's mess Pig like or

Cryptid sightings

just Sabrina Korean ghost I don't know

1:09:00

okay hello ladies I am currently listening to encounters episode 143 and the last time I emailed you ladies I told the story of how my family survived pele's curse no thanks to my klepto brother well this time I have a possible Bigfoot sighting that happened back in March and a slightly terrifying sighting of a mystery Cryptid so let's crack into it also we haven't read Laura's email about pele's curse on the show yet but I have it and we should okay because it's good so it was a chilly March day and I was bored and wanted to explore more of my new home of Southern New Hampshire so I took to Google to find some nearby haunted cemeteries as one does this is where I found Phillips Heil Cemetery in Joffrey New Hampshire and I may have butchered the pronunciation of those things I

1:10:00

apologize very close to where I am now so depending on how this goes I may or may not venture to especially New Hampshire if it's Bigfoot related right yeah this Cemetery isn't haunted but it has a very unique grave with an interesting backstory and I decided it would be cool to check it out so with my boyfriend in tow we set off to the cemetery which happens to be deep in the woods back from the road which adds to its peaceful spooky Ambiance I was in love so naturally I whipped up my phone and started filming videos for tick tock as my boyfriend and I were wandering through the graveyard he suddenly stopped and whispered see what I asked straining my eyes to see what he was pointing to in the distance and after a few seconds I finally saw it a very large brown blob moving about a

1:11:00

football field length away naturally I jumped to the only logical conclusion of what I was seeing Bigfoot it's Bigfoot I announced my boyfriend scoffed at me and responded no it's probably the back end of a moose or a bear now I have seen a moose butt before and that blob was way too tall and slightly too thin to be a moose butt and I don't think a bear can stand on tine legs for that long or be that tall while doing so so we made our way towards this mysterious block oh no and an investigator yes Laura but this is what you and I would do too so I know well because it's still far enough away right like it's not like it's right five feet away and you're inching even closer you're it still feels like you're you could make it out of the danger zone and you just need I don't know if your questioning is a Bigfoot you want a

1:12:00

little bit of a closer look um and just as quickly as we saw it it vanished if it was any animal a moose or a bear we would have heard it running away and if it was Bigfoot we would still hear him running away right so maybe it was Bigfoot's ghost or Bigfoot like you've said Corinne is an interdimensional being and can Zip Zap Zoop through timelines and dimensions okay keeping on the Cryptid train I have one more slightly unsettling story for you about the time I saw it now I say it because to this day almost 10 years later I still have no idea what I saw in my town in Pennsylvania which I grew up there used to be a poor house and with this poor house they had a Potter's field a plot of land with many unmarked Graves that was used to bury the residents of the Poor House when they died a not so fun fact is they found two

1:13:00

murder victims from a Cold Case buried there when I was in high school but I digress the poor house is no longer standing and all that is left is The Potter's field you would have no idea that there were bodies buried there if it wasn't for the cast iron sign that says Potter's field placed in the middle of the field as a type of Memorial in order to get to my childhood home you have to drive down the road with the field well one night when my parents were driving me home from wherever we were we were passing the field when I saw it imagine Professor Lupine in wolf form but more humanoid and less wolf and a pitch Shadow blacker than the Knight with glowing eyes hunched over arching its back almost to a point as soon as I saw it I immediately looked away and acted like I didn't I didn't say anything to anyone in the car and I tried to forget about what I

1:14:00

saw and keep my focus forward I had this thought that if I talked about or thought about what I saw that it would hunt me down and kill me you are the first people I am actually telling this story to after well over a decade of seeing this mysterious creature my gosh maybe it was a windy boy or a skinwalker but they're not on but they're not common in Pennsylvania I guess not unheard of maybe it was one of the spirits of one of the many poor souls that was buried in that field I don't know and I try not to think about it too much stay spooky and see you on the other side Laura I mean I don't know the glowing red eyes too I don't know what to think what do you think it's so hard to know but the fact that Laura had the thought in her head of if

1:15:00

I talk about this or think about it too much it will come and Hunt me like that's not just a thought you create I mean maybe but like that feels like a thought it put into her head like or just someone else who's like another Spirit another Guardian that's looking out protecting for Laura yeah to give warning of because this came after the Bigfoot butt situation right so everybody already knows that looks over Laura that she's very inquisitive and curious and might try to look into it more and follow this this thing and I don't know which one came first it might the Bigfoot butt might be more recent true because the it happened yeah for 10 years ago um uh oh it's in Pennsylvania that's not that's not far enough away from me this

Concluding thoughts

1:16:00

is scary you know what I really do believe in and I should have answered this when we did our um what conspiracies do you believe in I really do believe in werewolves um so it's very possible this is a werewolf or like a hellhound yeah I don't know yeah again there's so many Cryptids that it it's hard to know for certain but I love Laura's reaction for this one specifically just to like see it and be like nope nope nope never mind moving on not going to acknowledge that we're gonna look forward and just go on move on with life yeah yeah oh gosh I don't know I just sounded so much like Jennifer Coolidge [Laughter] oh oh yeah I love her I love her so much I watch

1:17:00

every single time a video comes up of her I watch the entire video yeah never skip I would love to just have a conversation with her I just want to know what she's truly like yeah is she always just like doing characters and like that's her personality like she's in a character doing this or that like what does she what does she like when like there's absolutely no one around her how did she answer the phone to her mom to her best friend you know like how did how did she or how does she talk to you yeah you know what they should do and I don't know why this doesn't exist I mean I guess Naked and Afraid is a show but like they should do interviews with celebrities where you don't see anything but like the interview happens naked because you're already so vulnerable that then you just share everything it's like hey you ready to see you just want to see Jennifer Coolidge naked no uh kind of I want her boobs

1:18:00

you love her I'm more mean like you know how they say people open up a lot more and this is why in documentaries like they'll record in cars just because you're not have you don't have to look at each other in the eyes and like feel safer and also I think the the movement like your brain anyway if something happens in the brain and I don't know about scientists but I wonder if there's something similar too if you're being if you're asking questions of someone when they're naked although it I'm see now I'm just like spiraling to myself but if I were naked having questions I would be so self-conscious that I wouldn't be open yeah yeah same I wouldn't be able to focus on anything except for the fact that I'm naked and there's a lot of people filming me yes I would go back to thinking about me as the Barbarian Maybe

1:19:00

that's the Cryptid yeah I needed some toilet paper it also made me think of the the Jersey Devil like what if there's yeah some version of like land-based or maybe the Jersey Devil just doesn't always fly I mean I know that this was in Pennsylvania but like very close it's not it's not far it's very close they border yeah so what if there are just this like variation of this creature that's just kind of like also sometimes walking on land and he just took a vacation to Pennsylvania yeah he's like I needed to get out of here in Pennsylvania yeah needed to go get some chocolate at Hershey Park I don't know I don't know either I'm curious if I feel like this is one of those stories that now that we've read it we're going to get emails from other people that are like holy I've seen the same thing and I've never told anyone I feel like that's what happens with stuff like this

1:20:00

it's a you know what it reminds me of there was a story we read from a listener or maybe it was on campfire stories I don't remember specifically but where there was like an entity jumping like roof to roof Ed told us that story on campfire stories he looked at wait right I think so and he saw like this crouching yeah like almost I don't know but yeah the gargoyle like crouching on yes yes okay I'm pretty sure that was Ed on campfire stories good memory wow I think it just I mean it's one that drives me so much that it was like a gargoyle jumping on the roof that I yeah yeah so I don't know there's just so right in the world that is mysterious and unknown to us and that is why you and I are embarking upon this adventure and journey of seeking out the unknown

1:21:00

yes but not inviting it into our homes no no but are very curious to hear if you've ever sought out and invited it into your house or not invited but accidentally opened up a portal or you know maybe perhaps it just came to into your life unfortunately yes and that's the whole reason we have an email and it is two girls one ghostpodcast gmail.com so please email us please do and there's a variety of ways to support us you can join us on patreon we do live streams every month we have a bonus merge we send out stickers what else we do so many things on there uh bonus episodes um add free episodes yes it's a joyous time you can also follow us on social media Tick Tock Instagram you can buy merch uh all those things all those things uh thank you to everybody who supports us all of you guys for listening everybody

1:22:00

who joins our pyramid scheme and tells everybody else to listen and also to our amazing editing team over at fire digital thank you to all of you yes we will and we will see you on the other side