Near Death Experience of Penny Wittbrodt with Penny Wittbrodt | Haunted with Two Girls One Ghost

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very spooky hey hey hey hey for the first time ever we got to actually talk to someone about the case that we have already covered about them it was the coolest experience ever so you covered the penny Whit bra near-death experience when was that it was months ago but essentially like the quick hit of it was Penny worked as a nurse had an allergic reaction essentially died and had these wild experiences on the other side

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visiting loved ones seeing herself communicating with something some being on the other side that maybe was experienced as God yeah her own grandmother like just so many things that are so magical that are just like oh my God there's so much power behind this story and we were Amazed by it covered it on an episode and then we got an email from her yes someone told on us someone told Benny that we the best case scenario because like that could be really scary like what if she listened to it and was like I hated what you said but no she was super she was like wow the way that you covered my story was incredible I would love to have a conversation with you we had some different ideas that she hadn't thought about in terms of her story she said every time she like recounts it and every you know as every day passes and the longer she's survived since then she continues to learn new things from it and have new takes and new interpretations of it but it's really really beautiful we spoke to her for like hours yeah she's easy to get along

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with that's for sure but we were like okay well beyond talking about it do you want to just come on and like tell your own story we've never gotten to have that happened before so Penny joined us and you're going to hear a few more details about her story her experience her near-death experience which near-death doesn't even feel like the right words for it cuz she quite literally did die she just came back she came back it's wild enjoy so you were

Religious background and miracles

raised Catholic correct and we had done an episode I think I had researched based on some of the articles that I had read about you and some of the interviews that I had seen your story last year and then we got in contact and are now having you on we were so excited when you reached out to us I called Ken immediately I was like you'll never believe who emailed us that's adorable so this is such a treat to actually hear firsthand from you about your story but what I found really interesting was how your story began

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which was a bit about how you were raised and some of your beliefs in religion could you tell us a little bit about that and then kind of how that changed yeah I mean I grew up my grandmother was Catholic but you know now that I think of it I don't recall I don't remember her ever going to church well we were both raised Catholic I feel like that's a very Catholic thing to do to just go to church what's it called like the Christmas Catholic the one you know like the holidays you go for the important holiday Christmas you go Palm Sunday so you can Whack The Palms ashman's day yeah yep exactly well and I like the faith I like the the symbolism it's beautiful uh the mass is beautiful it's traditional I like that so I think all those things will always feel warm and cozy to me because I grew up that way but not I didn't grow up long that way I made first communion when I was five six seven maybe seven it was shortly after that that my grandmother died and we quit going to church you know so I only have a seven-year-olds perspective but I've been to the

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Catholic church since and and I still feel like I'm pretty close so it's easier to explain it this way when I got divorced I moved with my parents with all my kids and my mom had found a Pentecostal church now girls you've not been to church until you've been to a black church or a Pentecostal church because it's totally different my daughter has a heart defect and she was just a toddler at the time and so I took her to the cardiologist and they scanned her heart and they're like like you know what we're going to have to close this hole she's got and she doesn't have enough tissue there she doesn't have a flap so we're going to have to put a patch on it which back then involved it was very involved it wasn't just is that an open heart surgery yeah yeah and it just I'm like what more could go wrong you know I'm just got divorced my kids are really struggling and now my daughter's sick and so they were going to do this surgery on her and I come home and I am just weepy right I she's asleep in the back seat in her car seat and I am just

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mess and I'm cursing God you know I'm like what is wrong with you you know what kind of maniacal evil monster are you that you couldn't spare us spare her this bit of suffering you know they've been through enough you you couldn't somehow fix this and so I was pretty angry and sad and scared and and so I get home and my mom so my mom had gone to this church one time before we moved there and it was a Wednesday night and she says you know you should you should go to church with me and I said you know Mom we've got to have the baby to the hospital really early in the morning and I'm worried this might be our last night and I I want to stay home with her and she walks out of the room and my mom's not like this it's the only time she's done something like this like real passive aggressive she walks out and she's like well if it were my daughter I know I don't want to go to church beforehand and I'm like son of a I'm here comes the guilt here comes the guilt right so we go to church and all I knew was Catholic like and and Methodist which is like Catholic light and

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Lutheran which is like Catholic light it's all pretty much the same and so we get to this church and everybody's you know kind of filing in and they're being loud and there's always in the Catholic Church there's always this real quiet reverence you know you don't do that like little kids don't get invited up onto the stage for story time because the stage would open up and hell would swallow them right behave be quiet there's a special room built for them in the back that has like there's a cry room I think they took us to the basement and it was like a dimly lit like concrete floor drop ceiling yeah we're going to suck your childhood out of you for an hour you can go back to your parents this is why neither of us have ended up being very religious and way more interested in just everyone's experience yeah and spirituality as a whole as a whole yeah but anyway so we get there we sit down and they start playing music well think of Catholic music in your head this was nothing like that and so they play this song you guys have to look it up after

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we're done it's by Mary Mary and it's called shackles and it's like a gospel hipop song and I didn't know there was even Christian music at the time I just thought there was music at church I didn't know there were radio stations I I just didn't know a lot yeah I'm looking around and people are up and they're bouncing and they're clapping so we go through this whole service everything's okay so at the end the pastor in Catholic Church they do the it's like this blessing that they do when you leave it's not like that in church so this pastor starts praying and he's quiet for a minute and some guy from two or three rows back just stands up and starts talking and he says somebody is here and they're having a hole closed that shouldn't be open and we need to pray over that person and my mom like sharp elbows me instant chills she's like just go go up there and I'm like I am not there is no way the pastor's like well let's give that person a little bit of time and it's just silent it's like you're passing a note in school and the

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teacher's like do you want to read that to the class and then makes you do it well and also it's to add to this it was so specific that it's not just like a generalized thing where it's like someone's about to have a really big life change and then 70 people come up on stage like it crickets throughout the audience because it related to just one person you and no one else knew except for your mom so it's like no and my mom hadn't been in contact with the church she'd only been there once nobody knew us right and so we sit there and we sit there and like the pressure I'm getting more and more nervous cuz I'm like crap these people are going to sit it out they're going to wait like it we'll be here till tomorrow if I don't say something and so the guy stands up again and he said it's a little girl and I'm like crap and I'm thinking okay I start shaking all over and feeling really weird and so I'm like okay let's go let just just get it over with and so we go up there she's asleep and I'm holding her in my arms and this guy gets this little container out of like oil but I don't know what that that is and I'm

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like oh no it's their Juju weird Voodoo sauce they're going to put it on my baby you know and he tip it's just frankincense and he tips his hand over and he makes the sign of the cross on her forehead and the guy who had said the thing looks at me and he says can I touch her and I was like okay and he took her little arm and he moved it off her chest and he put his hand over her heart oh he said in the name of God be healed still gets me yeah so we get out out of there I'm I'm just shaken up I can't sleep we get to the to the hospital the next day and the echo cardiograph guy comes in to scan her heart and she'd had scans like every three months her all the way up till she was two and he's like huh I said huh what what's huh and he's like I I just give me a minute so he looks for a little bit longer and he's like hang on so he goes and he comes back and back then they kept the recordings on VCR tapes right and so he brings the VCR tape in and he puts it in and he's like huh and I'm like huh what what what oh

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my God and I'm thinking something's terrible you know that's where my mind would always go yeah he's like hang on let me go get the cardiologist so he goes and gets her her doctor and the doctor comes in and they both look and they look at the tape and they both say huh and I'm like all right what the heck someone say what's happening say something and he said well you're not going to believe this but it looks like a little flap of skin has formed it's closed it off just enough that I think we can watch her for a while it took me a little bit to get my bearings and I saidwhat are you saying and he said I'm saying that as of today she doesn't need surgery that could change I don't know what's going to happen but you know you can you can take her home and I got in the car and I ugly cried for 45 minutes you not yeah and like because everything you had been feeling I'm sure just poured out of you oh the divorce everything yeah and just you know the flood and she's in the back seat and she's crying cuz I'm crying and she's like okay it's okay it's okay sweet baby

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and I'm like you're okay you're okay you're going to be okay you know and she was asleep by the time I got home and and I got in the yard on my face I just was so overcome and I'm like oh my God you listen to me I mean I cursed you and you still did this for me wow it won my heart in that moment to a different sort of God not a punitive God not a God that was waiting to you know whack me on the head for everything i' ever done wrong this was a God who loved her more than I did and it just broke a dam in me and and this is before your near-death experience yeah this was in 98 and my near-death experience was 12 years ago you know I have a friend who has a saying he says he has the best worst luck where he has a lot of unlucky situations happen to him but he has the best outcome and scenario possible when those situations happen and I feel like that applies a little bit to you Penny

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it's about attitude you know and I didn't learn that till my near-death experience you have to settle yourself I think people should tell their their kids as kids life's going to be hard there's going to be mean people there's going to be painful things that make you sad and make you you know wonder where your place is in the world and that's normal yeah it's just the nature of living on Earth and whatever happens I will use that as an opportunity to be my best self and to let God shine through me and if you have that attitude it is amazing the stuff that you can bounce back from that's really beautiful so 12

Workplace injury and medical trauma

years ago I was working as a nurse in a step down unit which is a unit that's Medicare only pays so many days IU and and if you're not getting better then they'll generally move you to a step down unit it's a lower reimbursement and it's longer term that sort of thing whereas ICU is meant for those real acute first days and so we would get a lot of people that were having trouble coming off the vent or had complicated

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wounds or traumatic brain injuries different things like that I've always worked in that really high level of care and we had this little guy who was a an eye doctor and nobody told us that he had a history of violence which was uncalled for because every day we had a safety meeting and on admission he had hit the director of nursing and knocked her over and she didn't tell anyone what oh my gosh and had I known that I would have never put him between me and the door right just as a safety measure and I would have gone into the room with other people so I go in there we've got a it's called a lowboy bed and it sits really close to the floor and we put a mat on the floor and it's for people who get up and who are really wobbly that way if they fall they're already sitting so we had him out of that but right next to it was this Jerry chair like a recliner and so it was set like a V and I went in between the bed and the Jerry chair and I was talking to him and I said okay Interventional Radiology is going to come up they're going to put a deep line in your neck I said so you

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know they'll come in they'll clean your neck they'll drape you explain the whole thing to him so he'll kind of know what to expect and I'm standing there and the doctor comes up and he comes up with his own nurse we're in there the door's slightly a jar and I'm standing between the bed and the chair the doctor drapes him and he beta dines his neck and he goes to get the scalpel to cut this little spot in his neck I guess it was an internal jugular we were putting in I can't remember but anyway so he bolts up and he says I do not consent to this and he punches me in the face and I fall between the bed and the chair and I can't get up because the bed's so low I can't push up I'm stuck and the doctor doesn't know how to release the recliner it's locked in place so the guy flails knocks over all the tray with all the tools on it and everything and then he comes over the chair like on his side and he just continues punching me in the side of the head oh my God Penny it totally Lucid he knew what he was doing oh my gosh apparently had been violent and abusive its whole life like I said

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would have been good to know so finally a tech across the hall hears the commotion and comes running across releases the chair pulls him away and gets me up and I'm shook but I you know I think I'm okay my shoulder's hurting my hand my wrist is hurting but I'm like I I think I'm mostly okay I finished my shift working with him he's like if you get if you have an injury you kept working with him yeah nurses yeah nurses man just we're made for endurance Don's like that 12-hour bladder I'll never know how you do it I go home that night and go to bed I get up the next morning and I turn my head to the left and my vision goes black so I turn my head back straight and I'm kind of seeing stars and then my vision starts to come back and I'm thinking what low blood pressure what would cause that that's weird because I didn't put it together with the movement initially so I I kind of sat there for a minute on the edge of the bed got my bearings got up and went into the bathroom and looked sideways again and couldn't see and got really dizzy and I'm like weird migraine like what on Earth so I

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go to work I get there and I saidou know what I'm going to have to go to the doctor I think something's wrong and so they send me to occupational health and they determine that I've sprained my wrist and done something to my shoulder put me in a sling put me on light duty and I get stuck watching cardiac monitors this all happens in August by November I'm not getting any better I've been to a shoulder guy of have a rotator cuffed hair I'm in a cast for a broken wrist I tell him one day this arm guy I saidou know it's the weirdest thing every once in a while I'll turn my head to the left and I can't see he's like what do you mean you can't see and I'm like I mean everything goes black not all the time just sometimes but several times a week and he's like okay we need to send you to a neurosurgeon and so he's going to send me to this neurosurgeon and he says now look this guy's super conservative I've not known him outside of emergency situations to do any surgery optional surgery on anyone and an optional surgery is anything that's not an emergency I go to him he does a CT scan of my neck and he's like oh my gosh it's bad we've got

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to do surgery this was on a Tuesday they send the CT scan over to the Crooked work comp Doctor Who can't be insured in the State anymore because he removed a patient's wrong leg in surgery and assaulted a surgery Tech and this is who the insurance companies hire as your independent medical evaluator the amount of people that you are encountering in this who are just I mean wow yeah horrible yeah yeah this is my independent medical evaluation a licensed physician I was like we need to record this like you couldn't take anybody in with you you're not supposed to take your phone because they don't want you recording it and I'm like if you're not doing anything wrong it's my doctor's visit why can't I record it right yeah so he writes that I have full range of motion that there's no pain there's no neurological issues and I was having clear neurological but you know weird reflexes things that you can't fake and um he writes that all down I go back to my neurosurgeon and he looks at the evaluation and he oh man he was spitting

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mad and and he actually writes in the chart this doctor either has no idea what he's looking at or has never looked at an MRI or he's a liar and I had never I mean I've read a lot of charting I've never seen a doctor call another doctor a liar especially on record right wrote it in the in the physician's notes yeah if we have to go after these people at least we've got some good documentation thank goodness you were able to have someone who could look at that and say this is complete BS because you know similar to religion I think we are told as young children that doctors are intelligent and extremely smart and that they know everything and or at least that's the belief that I was raised with and then you grow up and you're like wait a second they're also human they have flaws they're not perfect and they make mistakes sure so he's like you you have to have surgery this was on a Tuesday he scheduled me for Thursday this doctor who doesn't do surgery in less than a year ever and he's like it'll take you know maybe an hour hour and a half and then you know your h husband will be able to come back 6

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hours later he said C5 I can't I can never remember it's 4556 or 5667 but he said those discs were completely like exploded there were pieces all over and he had to pick them out they had to put my God Hardware in to fuse my spine together because I don't have those discs anymore I can't believe you are walking yeah that's what he said truly the only neurological symptom you were experiencing was loss of vision sometimes well loss of vision in like weird numbness down my arm like some some urinary incontinence that wasn't stress likee like when you sneeze or you know all the stuff that happens to women after that babies but it was different so we have the surgery I come out in the hard brace and can't return to work because they won't let work comp won't let me come back unless I can do all of my previous duties well there was no way I was ever going to return to full Duty so I'm just at home with my daughter I'm in the soft brace at this point I'm making smoothies for us and I give her hers she walks on the porch I get mine just straw normal strawberry

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smoothies and I had put some lemon flavored fish oil in them which I had tolerated forever but interestingly surgery can cause weird autoimmune things to happen and I go outside onto the porch it's a beautiful day and I go

Anaphylaxis and clinical death

to sit down out there and I'm like I feel weird and I couldn't quite put my finger on it and but it kept like kind of anxious kind of like I had to work a little harder to breathe kind of that sense that you get when you have to sigh but it it just wouldn't go away and I thought okay something's not right and then my mouth started itching and I'm like okay this I know that I'm having some sort of allergic reaction and I'm thinking well maybe I'll take some benad dril you know it could be anything seasonal heck who knows and then I notice I'm drooling and I'm like oh crap I'm having trouble swallowing so I go in and I'm like I'm I can't believe I'm going to have to take this EpiPen and so I take it my son takes me to the hospital and when I get there there's a nurse working the front desk who I knew from that hospital it's a very small

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hospital did not have fond memories of her I walk up to her and I'm looking up because I'm having trouble breathing and I'm obviously you can hear audible wheezing yeah and I put my the packages of epip pens are two packs and so I set the epip pen on the counter and I'm like infax and she's like well did you take the EpiPen I'm like I'm not an idiot I'm an ICU nurse and I'm like yes you know I'm still having trouble and she's like well I've got a clean room but I don't have a bed and I'm not exaggerating this because I am pretty tolerant and good-hearted of most people but this was scary so she's like well we'll take you back in a wheelchair and as soon as we get a bed in the room we'll put you in there which is not protocol so she takes me back in a wheelchair and there's a hallway that goes down past the nurses station and there's a doctor sleeping quarters and an employee restroom back there so nobody really goes down there especially during the day you know nurses can hold their pee for 12 hours so you're screwed in that Hall and it's it's even dark I'm not totally dark but

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dim and I'm sitting there and I'm thinking oh my gosh nobody can see me what's going to happen if I start having trouble again and I start having trouble again and it's just getting worse and worse and worse I'm starting to feel nauseous just all of these sort of anaphylactic type things and and I'm like crap I'm going to have to take that second EpiPen there is nothing that will get you in more trouble in a hospital than taking your own meds I mean they'll kick you out for crap like that I'm serious okay but if you need to and they're not taking care of you yeah the alternative is dying on the floor in this the alternative alternative is dying and I don't love you guys that much and so I'm sitting there and and I'm like well son of a gun here goes and so I stab my other leg and I start feeling better and I feel better for 15 20 minutes and then it starts again and I'm like oh my gosh I've got refractory anaphylaxis it's rare I mean generally you give them the EpiPen you give them some steroids and Benadryl you watch them for a couple hours and send them home as long as their blood

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pressure stable it gets to the point where I have Strider so Strider is when your Airway is closing so much that it makes a really loud whistling sound when you breathe and I'm looking straight up I'm wiping drool from my chin continuously and I'm and somebody hears me and this nurse practitioner PA I can't remember what she is looks down the hall and like oh my God runs down grabs the wheelchair pushes it into the room that has a bed gets me up in it well now my blood pressure is dropping and I'm a horrible stick and they can't get an IV in and I mean they've everybody's around me everybody's trying different veins the whole thing Ow like veins up in my breast everywhere they're trying so they give me a shot of Benadryl a shot of steroids you know an intramuscular shot of epinephrine and they repeat and repeat by the time I was flown out of that hospital IID had 500 milligrams of Benadryl 50 milligrams is the dose and I was only there a couple hours and the lady looks at me and she says we got to

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move you across to trauma and I'm like oh I'm gonna die and this is on top of the epipens that you already took oh go yeah yeah I ended up with like six shots of epinephrine two doses of steroids I can't even imagine what mental state you were in and the fear that you were feeling I'm so glad I'm not scared to die now because if it happened again I'd probably be a little more okay but I was terrified and so they had called my husband who wasn't my husband at the time but we'd been together a long time and he walks into the room and I remember I just have never been so relieved to see somebody in my life and he walked in and just the terror in his face and he yelled from the room you guys better do something you're going to lose her Airway wow the doctor comes in and he's like no no we've got plenty of time before that happens so let's drag our feet you know they've got a little IV in it's about half out because if they try to push it in any further it won't run so I have this very tenuous very small when you have anaila we want to put the biggest IV we can get in you like if I could get

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a 14 in you because we may have to pressure bag fluids to run them in it's like a blood pressure cuff that goes around the IV bag of fluids so it'll squeeze in as fast as possible so you need the most but they are only able to give you basically the least right at this point in fact they're not even able to use it for fluids they're just using it for meds and the doctor's like no no we've got plenty of time and I'm sitting straight up in the bed and I've got my head up and I've got a washcloth because I'm drill ring and just suddenly I just

Entering the void

collapsed that was it I was out and I popped out of my body immediately and was above myself iard my husband yelled for help and all these people come running in I hear the code call go off I'm watching what's going on in the room I see the people run in as they're running in pushing him out as they're filing in my husband and I see this the respiratory therapist who I didn't know and he had a bald spot on the crown of his head which I could not have seen from the bed of course and I'm like huh so somebody's really sick and I didn't recognize myself oh wow and I'm watching

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the whole scene play out and I'm like man I hope she's okay and then I pop out I'm out again so your astral self like your soul didn't remember or have recollection of everything that you were going through yeah you're right yeah I just didn't it was like it hadn't implanted in my brain or something and to not even know myself laying there like I didn't recognize that woman on the bed wow and so they intubate me and the helicop gets there and this I know of course from after but the helicopter gets there they do an intra Aus IV which is where they use like a Dremel tool to screw a needle into your shin bone and they deliver the IV fluids that way because you can give huge amounts that way they were doing what they could and what and what they were doing was protocol it just wasn't working and I don't think any of them had ever seen refractory anaphylaxis most doctors I talked to have no idea what Mass Cell Activation disorder is and I didn't know I had it right and so they intubate me they put the intra Aus IV and they put

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me on a helicopter and it is the worst electrical storm that those Pilots had ever flown through in one of the worst electrical storms in Kentucky history and I'm in a helicopter oh my gosh and it's so funny because I'm scared of helicopters and my cousin Frank who's since passed it was on my bucket list of things to overcome and do and and so I told Frank I said well you didn't have a choice right this time I mark it off my bucket list and I'm talking my cousin Frank who's hysterical and he's like oh no I don't think so I said what he's like you can't Mark that off your bucket list you were completely unconscious it doesn't count I did it though I did it I did it I didn't fall out I didn't crash I didn't go crazy I wasn't terrified I mean if you're gonna go in a helicopter I recommend going in on propa Fall because nothing bothers you and I did Mark it off my bucket list dang it Frank and so they fly me to a bigger Hospital in lexingon and I'm in a coma in an induced coma for 5 days so while

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all that is going on I materialize kind of like in an ethereal sense in the backseat of my sister's car she's not really my sister but I have known her forever we got pregnant together we raised kids together and so she's in Wisconsin we're in Kentucky and I'm in the backseat of her car and it's dark it's pouring rain and I know something's wrong with me because I don't have my normal density and I'm thinking what is up I feel weird I like how also your observations were just about like your floating sort of self instead of like wait a second how did I go from the hospital room yeah to the back of the car I didn't know about any of that I didn't remember seeing the person in the ER I didn't like I knew who she was but the memories were very sparse as to what had happened that day and so it's pouring rain and I can't feel the seat on my legs or my back and I'm like okay so seriously up I don't want to scare her so I'm not going to say her name or

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anything but I she pulls over into this under this canopy at a gas station and she pulls out her phone I lean over to look and she's wearing she's a red head and she's wearing this horrible top that's very wrinkled and these bottoms they don't match it's completely clashing with her complexion and her hair which wasn't a thing she would normally do and I'm like what is happening with you I love that this is what you're thinking but also these are such important moments right for you to recall later these are sister thoughts these are things sisters been say to each other and it's a clue that something wrong is happening if she normally puts herself together really well and then now you're seeing this like disheveled version of her yeah it's confusing to you as well and so she pulls over she's at this gas station she pulls out her phone she opens up Facebook and she types in hang on kiddo I'm coming which was a message to my daughter in private messaging so there's no way I would have known or seen that and then I'm I'm just out of the car I'm

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back to completely deeply unconscious so I wake up and I'm in this really really pitch black like if if you've gone to one of those sensory deprivation rooms oh wow like that kind of dark I have this mental image of me in the space and I in the image I'm not standing I'm not sitting I'm not lying down I'm just being held by some force and I feel this pressure on me and I'm super claustrophobic and it felt like it was holding me and I immediately start freaking out and trying to move and I can't move I can't get away and at the height of that panic attack I'm sucked back into the deep sleep and so this goes on I wake up I freak out I go to sleep I wake up just on and on and on did you feel anything when that was happening like did you feel like you were a rubber band being snapped back and forth or were you just kind of blipping into these different yeah it was just existences you know you're either this way or you're that way and it was sudden and and I was always really grateful for the deep sleep because it brought an end to that panic

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and and I'm not a an anxious person by nature but you try to hold me down or put me in a close space watch your own life I'm gonna have your DNA all over me I'm serious I'm like look I would not run from someone if they were after me I would fight and there would be no way they could not identify you because even if I died like it only takes three pounds of pressure to rip off someone's ear wow and I taught my kids this when they were very young I'm like look you grabbed that ear three pounds of pressure you got there ear they're gonna find the earless man okay I'm happy to hear that yeah yeah I do think about that though about like using your nails to scratch and get as much DNA as possible yeah well and if you're grabbed from behind you can't knee them in the groin or punch them in the throat the things that they normally teach women do my God you can pull off an ear go for the ear or I always say do a move that's unpredictable that makes them confused wet willy no one's expecting to get wet wied when they're being the attacker and so anyway I'm flipping back and forth

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and if I had to time there is really weird like it doesn't seem chronological that's exactly what I was going to ask how time it almost reminds me of um what's that space movie Interstellar Interstellar a little bit it sounds like Interstellar that sound when they're in space this kind of it's like a white noise oh wow cuz I went to see that movie with my sister-in-law and it it shocked me and made me nauseous and I'm like oh my God that's the noise from the void and I mean like I was shaking it was so scary to me and so I'm going back and forth and the time is different and things are happening in an orderly way that I can understand but they seem like they're happening all at once without chaos it's very strange the perception of time is very different you know I was only in a coma for five days but it felt like 10 years there I mean really like if I look back and think of what the last 10 years feels like it felt like that and and you know I start asking myself questions I'm thinking and

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wondering and I'm like what where am I like was that life that I remember was that even real did I just make that up so I would have something to think about here so I wouldn't go crazy you know it's like when you when something bad happens to you years later even happens with ndes years later you're like did that really happen like you start doubting yourself you know right I mean it's really powerful what the brain does to protect yourself yes anyway I was there and so I started wondering you know and then I thought well maybe maybe I'm in hell maybe I did something really bad like so bad that I had to be banished and I'm so evil that no one even misses me which is such a sad terrible I know feeling for you to have to live with in this void yeah as a Believer yeah yeah another thing to note about this is your thoughts are still yours pertaining to the life that you lived this time it's not like you moved forward into the space and you're

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suddenly all knowing and there's all this love and light like you're still going through these same thoughts that you might have if you're sitting in your fleshy body here on planet Earth yeah that's exactly what it was like it was my Earth brain in a very different realm and with no one else to support you you were completely alone no instruction manual no Post-it notes nothing to help me figure this out yeah and and so I finally got this idea that this place must be unique to me because there's nobody else there and I'm like I'm alone this place is unique to me why am I here feels like if I could figure out why I'm here I could figure out how to get out and so every time I would have one of these little Revelations there would be some new movement I could make I'm standing and I realize that if I angle my whole body not just bend at the waist but angle my whole body as I do that I start to slowly move forward and the more I get horizontal the faster I go

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wow so I see what looks like a really

Observing the physical realm

like if you were coming down a dark Street and Eight houses up there was a light in the window you know how you could just barely see that from the end of the street it wasn't like a tunnel glow or anything more than a nightlight there and so I see that and I'm like okay yes that's I'm going to go that way and so I flatten out and I start flying flying that way and I am flying like car speed flying and I'm thinking I have no idea Superman stance like forward my arms were down at my side but I was going that way I was like this is Inc and I used to have flying dreams all the time as a kid where I would be walking and I would hit the curb my foot would hit the curb and I would lift off and I could actually this is interesting I hadn't remembered this but I could actually realize in a dream that I was having a dream and then set off to Flying almost like an out of- body experience you Lucid dreamed yeah as a child I've not able to do it since I was little like primary school but yeah I

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could do that and I remember I used to like going to sleep because if I could in a dream realize I was dreaming then I could fly and I would also have like this is really cool I don't normally tell this but so one time I'm having this dream I'm I'm maybe in fourth grade and my best friend um was Bobby and I had this lucid dream that night that I was flying and there was a store behind us called The Patio market and I flew over the patio market and there was a bleached Sun un bleached white frisbee on the roof that said s an and I'm like what is scene that is not spelled right um and it stuck with me when I woke up and so I was telling my friend Bobby about this dream I had and I said let's climb the building and he's like oh no we'll get in big trouble if we do that and I'm like no no we'll just wait till they close and we'll go we'll climb the building so we climb the building that freaking frisbee is on the building and he's like that says Sean are you swe kidding me yes so you've already been astral projecting and having these

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experiences just not knowing that you were in the astral State yes and I think everybody can do that like I don't know that this is abnormal I believe it too and I mean think about how many people have had similar experiences but then don't do the climbing to the roof of the building to be you know yeah and I'm a big fact-based person you know like I like to find all of the details all of the clinical trials I want to read that and get my brain around it understand it for myself and I was that way as a little kid but anyway so I'm flying and it's not unfamiliar to me because I was able to do it as a child just not in the dark and I don't know where I am I don't know if if it's a forest you know am I going to plow into a tree I have no idea but I can see that light and I'm thinking as long as I can see the light as fully as I can see it now then there's probably not anything in front of me and so I go go go and I get to the light and it's on my right so I fly to the left it's on the right and I look and looks like I don't know if they still have them but

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these big glass blocks that they would use in hotel rooms arounders and it would let the light through but it would distort the person enough that you could be in the bathroom with them and you knew there was someone in the shower but you couldn't out their features we actually just stayed at a hotel where their top floor had this all around the atrium yes and we were yeah we were discussing that it kind of reminds you of like a swimming pool like yes yeah yes I couldn't see through it I could tell there was something on the other side but I couldn't make it out and so I get closer and closer until my nose touches the glass and when my nose touches the glass I can see through the through the glass and and I'm there in the hospital room I recognize me I'm on a ventilator my daughter is standing behind me and to the right right in front of the ventilator and she's wearing this red flannel shirt and I immediately remember it's August and I'm like you weirdo why are you but it's so Laura why are you wearing a red flannel shirt my Vision becomes so acute that I can see every thread in that shirt and I

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can see what the threads are made of and I know what they feel like I know what they smell like I know what they taste like and they're making musical noise yes I mean you saw the world in the way that probably certain animals and creatures do that will never have the ability to understand on the other side you will but yeah I was like that shirt's incredible that's why she wore it you know a so my daughter's really really a private person we're close but she's a Scorpio should tell you everything you need to know and she just doesn't share her innermost feelings generally and I can see my daughter in the room standing in front of the ventilator how to I explain this it was like my Consciousness went into her oh and I experienced what it is like to be Laura I felt her feelings and I she was always so emotionally controlled I mean I remember one time as a teenager that she cried but I'm in her and I am

40:00

feeling her feelings and she's so scared you know with my other kids I've experienced their feelings with them before but not so much with her and it it broke something in me and so I had my hands and you know my nose pressed against the glass and I just instinctively tried to put my hands out to pull her to me to hold her and they hit the wall and I lost it I was screaming oh I was mad cuz I'm like this is cruel this is a level of cruel that I don't understand you could be in her Consciousness and feel it but you cannot support her or hold her I can't touch her yeah GH and she has no idea that I'm there and I'm just laying there in this bed you know like in that moment I thought well I'll just get sucked back in but it didn't happen and and so I get sucked back onto the other side of the wall further back and I'm ugly crying and and carrying on and I'm like what kind of God are you you know are you doing this to me I don't understand what's happen and you know why show me this if if I can't get

41:00

back and and that's cruel and and so the more upset I get I start getting sucked back to the original spot and I go back to sleep and so I wake up and I'm like okay let's try to keep it together this time and so I level out head back and when I get there the wall instead of being like that glass brick is like a bubble and it's moving and I'm like oh

Realizing the power of mindset

this is a new development I get up to it and I put my hand on it and my hand goes right through and so I got one hand on that side and one hand on this side and the hand on that side feels more dense than the hand on this side and I'm like okay there's like a whole different feel to that space and and I'm like I don't know what to do like should I push the other like what happens if can I get lost I don't know you you just don't know yeah and so I'm thinking I bet now I can get through and I'll wake up because that makes perfect sense and so I put the other hand up against the bubble and it pops through and then I just go through with it and so I'm now over me and I'm looking down on the bed I can see that my hands are restrained to the bed we

42:00

always restrain ventilator patients so they don't pull out their tubes and I freak out because I'm like oh I don't like being restrained and yeah I'm sure that's a past life thing somewhere but it just immediately sets me to panicky and I'm like okay calm down calm down you know you're on this side this is huge you don't want to get sucked back well shoot I didn't pop back in now what and I thought oh I bet if I like hover down and lay down on myself then I'll just get sucked back in like a sponge so I tried that that didn't work and I'm like I would have thought that too right like that feels a logical thing to do right and I I'll wake up it's a puzzle piece it's you put the square Block in the square hole and that's what happens well and I had looked you know because I was assessing I remembered I was a nurse because I looked at the IV and I saw what fluids were running and I'm like oh I'm in an induced coma got fentanyl going propol going at a drip rate that I recognize and and I'm like okay well if I'm in an induced coma then that means I can wake up my Vital Signs aren't great but

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they're stable so I'm like okay I'm critical but stable oh yes I was a nurse that's why I know all this stuff I didn't make it up I think okay well Penny you're just starting too big let's just try to wake her up because if you wake her up you'll definitely get sucked back in right and so I'm focusing on her face in the bed and I'm like come on come on you know wake up wake up and she won't do it I oh damn it I can't wake me up and I'm like okay start smaller and so I think just move her finger if you can get her to move her finger that'll be enough because then there will be this connection between my mind her mind I'll get sucked back in and I'm focusing on her finger and focusing on her finger and it won't move and I'm like damn it and I get sucked back but I'm just on the other side of the wall and so now I'm so close it's like you know when you've been on this journey that's been so long going through something in life that seems like it has been going on or it has been going on for years and you have no perception of the end of it and then suddenly you can see it and you're

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exhausted you think you can't go anymore but once you can see that end you start running right that's what it was like and so I'm like I I'm right here I'm right here I'm so close I'm not going to mess this up and so I start being very rational which is I'm very pragmatic so that's natural for me and I'm like okay what is this place and why are you stuck here and I thought well there's got to be a reason there has to be some lesson in this there's got to be something I've got to understand hand right to make this all stop and it just Dawns on me I don't know if God put it in my head but it just popped into my head you made this place I as soon as I heard it I knew it was truth and there was this I grew up on Michigan by uh Lake Erie and dad would take us out in the spring um when it would start to thaw and you could hear this ice cracking and it's this really haunting noise because it starts at the shallow and then it goes out deeper and deeper and deeper and it's just I've never heard anything else that sounds like that but that's what it was like and so this fissure happens at the top this it feels like I'm in an egg

45:00

that feels like what the space is and it cracks at the top and light starts streaming in and as the light starts streaming in it starts cracking further and further apart and I can see all these other lines where it's cracking I'm overcome I'm like this is something different this something is happening now I've done it it's also so wild because it's like you're being told that you made this place but things appear to just be happening around you and it's not like you're consciously being able to control what's happening like you're asking to do certain things and finding obstacles still in this space it almost to me reiterates how powerful the subconscious is like your subconscious is ruling it and your conscious mind was like you they were at odds with one another there are these thought patterns that are so ingrained that you get in these situations in life on this side where they're repetitive in your life because you can't break that thought pattern and so you know it's relationships or jobs or whatever the

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thing is that just keeps keeping it's because we get stuck in these mindsets and we can't think of a different way to think about it and think of a different way to handle it and so you're stuck you just get stuck in those ruts and you're you're there and it's over and over and over again yeah but in that moment I thought I have to do something different I have to understand that I made this and then it just all fell into place I'm like oh my God of course I made this you know when I got divorced as crushing as that was you know that my husband was cheating and I found out and then he abandoned us and went with this other woman then I had to move with my parents because I was a stay-at-home mom I couldn't support us I wasn't a nurse incredibly difficult yeah I mean I did all that alone with three kids which right there that's a challenge of Faith too with everything that you were going through so I'm on the other side I'm trying to get back in my body I found the light okay so I'm thinking back on my life and I'm like I did make this place and I'm not even upset about it it's just this incredible

47:00

like if you found out that that you had $5,000 extra in your bank account because you routinely were bad at math and didn't even think to double check yourself and then somebody said here's a calculator and you went through and you're like oh my gosh I could totally it was like that like in in a moment I understood and I'm like yes I was looking back at all these tragedies the divorce and him abandoning the kids and and I'm like you know what could see it like I had done it physically like I had taken a brick and put it down and taken another brick of something that had hurt me and put it down and stacked and stacked and stacked until I'd stacked them all around me and I was in a jail and I was my own Jailer and I didn't even realize it you know what so wild so I recently did a a bunch of trauma treatment and in part of it I did EMDR and I truly in the the work visualized the brick wall and it was a brick wall and it was was like I had to piece by piece pull them down to deal

48:00

with it that is exact it's work it is labor you know you can only run from trauma for so long anyway I'm just seeing that I built this wall to protect me you know and I had shut myself off from people I was living a fake life I mean I'm generally cheerful and I'm happy no matter what kind of work I do so so that's just my basic personality but I was going out of my way not to connect with people people would call and I wouldn't answer the phone cuz I get anxious about talking on the phone like getting on the other side of the door became more and more of a challenge for me like once I get on the other side of the door I'm good I can go yeah but man I battle that door I I have every excuse in the world I'm like I could order the groceries or I can ask Don to pick it up on the way home because it wasn't a door it was a brick wall it was the brick wall right anyone could get out a door but a brick wall is so much harder right and I would always say that my biggest battle is the door and I'm like the biggest battle is not the door your big battle is the jail youve put yourself in just walk out and it's so

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funny we cling to our chains it's so hard to walk out you're sitting in a pile of but at least it's warm and familiar and my dad's a Navy man and he's told me that my whole life that is a very relatable way to put it yeah it is you're like this is horrible I hate living like this but I don't know what to do to un to stop it have you seen the movie it's a Disney Pixar movie It's called Soul no it came out a few years ago it's about this man who he basically has a near-death experience or like he he dies and he's sent into the ashel plane and some of the themes that we're talking about today with your near-death experience happened in that movie and then I'm thinking about how we referenced Interstellar before and I think it's a question that probably the three of us don't have answers to but it's like are the people who are making these films are they studying people like you to put this into the story or is there something within all of us that like we just know what could happen it's probably a combination of things yeah I think you're exactly right that it's a

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combination so back to your experience you see this brick wall at what point how how are you able to get back into your body okay so I see the you know the brick wall I realize I built it and my grandmother is there she greets me as I

Reunion with grandmother

have all of this understanding the lights rushing in all of a sudden there's this huge Spirit clothed in light probably 10 foot tall coming toward me but she has a like she's wearing a gown of light but I can see that she has arms and a head and you know everything else looks normal like you'd expect somebody in a long gown to look and so she comes to me and she's familiar immediately but I don't remember who she is she puts her arms out to me and I'm drawn into her arms without her touching me once I get to her arms I'm right to her chest and she puts her arm around me and she holds me like this and all these shards of the darkness are like broken glass and they're flying around us trying to get in at me and she would put out her fist and punch them and they would shatter and be gone what a badass that was my

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grandma and how beautiful yeah that was her that is the power that we have over darkness that we just don't realize that we think we're subject to Darkness we are not we have authority over darkness and she showed me that I'm like well son of a gun that would have been life-changing information you know you've been alone battling all these things happening to you in the darkness and you're like oh I could do that yeah she died when I was really young like nine so I think I probably could have gotten a lot of wisdom from her had she lived longer and so I'm in her arms and I'm crying ugly snotty crying and she says calm yourself dear one but just in my head she doesn't speak it I'm shocked immediately because I'm like oh what I knew the voice I knew it was coming from her it wasn't a thought I knew it wasn't an internal thought because sometimes those are hard to tell apart and I calmed like somebody had injected me with a drug I mean I couldn't stop it it was like the words broke apart into their elements and then came into me and calmed me and so I'm super calm I'm in her arms and so I look up and she got these blue green eyes and they're just

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beautiful beautiful and I could tell she loved me just looking at her I look up and on the top of her head she's got this orange hair and it's on fire and I knew then I'm like oh my gosh grandma lva and I looked at her and I'm like I thought you died and I start crying again and she's like no there's no death you're either alive in your physical body or you're super alive here super alive I love that right it's so comforting to hear that too when my cousin Frank died people asked me they're like does death so I guess death doesn't bother you and I'm like oh no death's crushing but I don't call it death Frank's super alive and the geography sucks and eventually we'll bridge that I just don't have the vehicle for it right now and that's okay and so I just was overcome and she said you know this and I'm like no and she said you do you know this you've known this since you were a little girl you learned this in primary school and I'm like I don't know what you're talking about I did not learn this and she said Penny energy isn't

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created or destroyed it just changes form that is God's law Borrowed by man yeah you know as a nurse I was like how could I not know that I know that like I've seen I've been at the bedsides I've done palea of care you know and and end of life care that energy has to go somewhere it is not an we are not an exception to that rule nothing is an exception to that rule right that has been the most proof I've Ever Needed that there is another side that we exist we go on God Lives because you cannot violate the laws of nature you just can't anyway I'm just I'm overcome that she's there and and she was just this incredible woman in life and so much more so in death and so I asked her I said am I dead and she said no no no you're kind of special you're in between and she said if you decide to stay there's a cord that's attaching you to your body and if you decide to stay the cord will be cut and then you'll just be here with us but if you decide to go back then then you'll go back and you'll

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come back here later and it'll be okay I'm like all right I'm in let's stay you know this incredible yeah I mean it's beautiful yeah marveling at everything in front of you the warm feelings and being back with your grandmother and yeah and I've got a kid opportunity to know everything but then I yeah I can imagine it's so hard too when you actually start to think about that decision and your daughter who you just were able to finally experience all of her emotions for the first time and then yeah what was that like when you started to realize oh wait yeah how did you change your mind do I choose to stay here or I immediately went selfish mode and was like I am staying this is amazing I don't have the emotional weight of the world I don't have all the weird misgivings about myself I don't feel judged I just feel so peaceful I just want to stay you know it's like when you wake up and you're in that perfect position sleeping that's so hard to get into not getting out of bed right and you try you wake up from a dream and you try to go back to sleep because you

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just it's so good and you never can yeah but there it was that unending goodness and so she like goes away I'm like unconscious but awake it's weird I didn't realize she had left and I'm just kind of floating in this incredible light just I'm so relieved to not be in the darkness and and know that there's beings here and I don't know how long I was there but eventually I heard this rumbling like the loud Thunder rumbling you've ever heard times a bunch and I could see all the way to the beginning of time and all the way to the end of time and everything was shaking people in their graves were shaking rocks were shaking and it's imperceptible to the human eye but on that spiritual creation level as God is coming toward me and thundering everything is responding to him wow did

Meeting God and the life review

you have any emotion when this happened like were you fearful I was terrified yeah yeah because I knew it was God and I'm like oh crap and these were my

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actual thoughts oh crap she could read my mind if she can read my mind he absolutely is going to be able to read my mind and so I immediately start trying to think of something good I've done in life because I want to have something right there told you I'm practical so I'm like come on come on there's you I was a nurse I nothing nothing I'm just of course when you need to think of it it's like empty I could tell you a million stories today good not thing all of that goes out of my brain and I am just in awe of this thing that is coming toward me and so it gets right up to me and it's just that you can tell it's the source of this light but the light is still all around too it's lighting up the whole place and he stopped and I say he I didn't see him but the energy is very masculine the voice was male and I look and he says I am and I had heard that a million times it's in the Bible it's Christmas stories you know all that kind of stuff I am that I am am I'm like what what are popey what does that mean I understand that he was saying I am I am where

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everything started I knit you together in your mother's womb I am love and I am the energy that set everything in motion and you're here with me and I made you and I love you and I never understood what he meant by that I am and in that moment I understood it in fullness and I wasn't scared and and so immediately these scenes from my life start to play and he's going to I know we're going to have a Life review even though i' never heard of such a thing and so I'm thinking well there's a lot of good stuff to choose from you know there's a lot of bad stuff to choose from but sure I think I'm I think I'm solid on the good stuff and he brings up this scene where I'm at a grocery store like the lowest end Aldi kind of grocery store you could go to and there's a woman in front of me buying groceries and she doesn't have she's just short Change to be able to get everything and so she starts picking stuff that I know is for her and not for her kids and starts putting it she's like okay I don't need this you know this can go back and I was like oh my gosh I have been there so many times counting change and borrowing money from my folks and it just whatever

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I mean to buy food I know what that's like and it's such a humiliation and a shame not to be able to pay for something right and it feels impossible to crawl out of too it does it does you're you're trying to do everything you can to love these people assigned to you in life and how are you supposed to do it with this oppressive poverty so I see this woman she's not got enough money and I say to her very quiet I'm like hey it's okay let me help I've got it and she's just mortified no no no it's fine it's fine I don't really need that anyway you know and I'm like please I've been there take it oh and so she took it I didn't even remember it it was such a small thing right and I'm like that I've saved lives I fought off a child abuser to save a child that wasn't related to me and my job I've Done big things that have been very helpful and that's it that's what you what you bring up the moment that's it and he said let me show you and so he shows me years

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down the road this same woman is working at a food pantry and another woman comes in with exactly the same look on her face as she had in that grocery store and she said I don't have enough money for food and the lady behind the counter who I had helped is like it's okay I've been there come on let me help you it's incredible how these small moments that like you said you hardly remembered yeah have such a domino effect in in a really powerful way well and the importance of

Lessons on negative energy

that is everybody's like I just don't know what my purpose is or what I'm supposed to be doing here and I'm like whatever's in front of you today whatever's in front of you today and pay attention you know like if the lady down the street you see her she's 80 years old and she's struggling to drag her trash can up to the curb and back every week and you see it and you notice that just walk down there and take her trash can back for her and that's your purpose that day and that's enough not to get to like chew into certain things but like certain people publicize every time they do something good and I'm like why do you need to do that and then it makes me

1:00:00

because they need the affirmation right right yeah but it does make me think of this for myself too it's like one of my goals is to be able to do something good for other people so frequently that it doesn't even become a thought that we're doing it and it's never something we remember just as you hardly remembered this interaction this exchange with this woman in the grocery store well you know I was telling my podcast the other day I said you know I hear a lot of younger women and you know they're struggling I think because they labor under a lot of false ideas you know they're like oh my gosh I just kill my husband the basket's right there and he can't get his socks into it and you know what the heck I'm not his maid and and I said you know what what if you just changed your mindset because you got to pick up the socks either way he's not going to do it what if you just changed your mindset and said wow he's at work all day he's really tired when he comes home and I can do this little thing that blesses him and just pick those socks up and put away and it's a small thing that you can do to make him feel loved and it goes

1:01:00

such a long way it does it's interesting too just your comment that you just made about someone maybe complaining like oh gosh they never do this or they never do that because one of the things that really stuck out to me with your story is when I had heard you discuss being shown some of the negative thoughts you had towards another employee who you just had to pick up a lot of their slack and it's it's not to say that they were a bad person or they sucked at their job but it was negatively impacting you and we're all human we all have those thoughts and it's so interesting that you were shown that and like the power of even your thoughts and anything spun in a negative manner whether it said out loud or just thought by someone in passing how that energy moves and it sticks to that person and it makes that person's life that much more difficult to get out of that situation and throughout the seven years of Sabrina and I doing this podcast we receive a lot of emails we've met a lot of people we've heard a lot of stories from

1:02:00

different people and it has been really fascinating hearing certain people talk about discovering their own energy and their own power and having to really focus sort of their thoughts their excitement because they can see the real life consequences almost immediately and it really does help people or at least it helps me start to try to change like if I find myself in a pattern of kind of negative thoughts about someone being like Oh my gosh well I'm not it's only going to get worse if I keep thinking this it builds and it's hurting you more than anyone it's not hurting them it's hurting you yeah they don't know yeah but they could they could feel that that energy and that vibration heading towards them and that was the negative thing he showed me you know there was this woman that I worked with that was terrible she was in my estimation lazy and I'm not a person who gossips I've always hated it and so I the there was this woman I dreaded working with she wouldn't answer her call light she wouldn't turn off alarms in the room and I was always doing her job and my job and rightfully so I would have negative feelings about that I'm not saying you

1:03:00

shouldn't have them because there are obvious things that are unequal but the thing was that God showed me he said let me show you something and so he showed me back to when she was a little girl when she was very little and her father started raping her up until she left the house horrific and so she had endured a drug problem and all kinds of other issues related to that early trauma and it just hit me oh my gosh this person who has been robbed from spiritually emotionally and physically her whole damn life went into a caring profession she's trying to turn the table and she has her own brick wall that's built up to protect her and that's like what you're hitting you know and causing you to have that feeling and that's why she's being an you know it's not that she wants to be it's the damn brick wall is just it's impenetrable until you figure it out yeah and so he said look your thoughts have power your words have power and actions have even more power but where did it all start with the

1:04:00

thought you have got to take captive your thoughts and subject them to what you know is true spiritually because now if you don't you're stuck in this situation where every day you come in and you get assigned to work with her your your whole day is different as soon as you see her your whole day is different you're like ah crap gonna have to work two people's shifts today you know she's not going to be any help she's not friendly and so then I would go through that whole shift with that downcast heart I never said anything and I never would right and God's like what if you had done it differently what if you had said hey that coight's going on in there I'm going to run in and get it but you know next time if you could get it or hey can you come help me if I buddied up with her more I could have mentored her but instead of doing that I just held this grudge against her and it's like when you walk into a room and two people are fighting but they stop when you walk in you can feel that you feel the energy absolutely the tension is like a knife and I imagine that's what working with me was like for her I love this so much because I feel like

1:05:00

the sentiments you are learning from this experience are things that we learn as young kids like treat others the way you want to be treated and everyone's dealing with something and you don't always understand but when you're living life you get so caught up in it that you almost just like you get caught up in your own and you forget to take a step back and this was almost like a forcing function for you yeah this is why the book um everything I ever needed to know I learned in kindergarten was so popular because it took you back to this basic core truth of life you know clean up after yourself be kind to people treat them the way you'd want to be treated you know don't destroy other people's things but it all goes back to those core things yeah and so you know when he showed me that even though I had never given voice to it I had given voice to it by by harboring it sure it just was the most important lesson to me

Breaking generational curses

and so I have to be completely willing to to go this next step with him and I immediately bristle up and you know he's

1:06:00

not asked me anything I just have this knowing and and I said you know what no no I'm not I'm not going any further with you you say that you love us and that you care about us and I call BS on that because when my kid's dad left I prayed and I prayed and I prayed I didn't want it restored you know the marriage but I didn't want my kids abandoned that was it you know and I'm like I made a bad choice and and I'm suffering because of that and that's okay because I'm a grown-up but these are little kids and he calls and says he's going to send something and I watch my kids walk out to that mailbox every damn day and walk back empty-handed I'm like how could you do that and it was just so upsetting right it feels so incredibly cruel it does they're little kids I'm like haven't they suffered enough it just broke me and I'm like that's why I'm so angry with you I'm so angry with you and he let me have it he let me be that angry you know like when you've got a little kid like a toddler that's freaking out you can't really

1:07:00

talk them out of it because they're little kids sometimes they just need to feel and express it but him making it okay you know it's okay that you're having all these negative feelings it's okay that you've lashed out at me and he said oh dear one you've completely misunderstood me let me show you something and so this scene plays out and so at the time of my near-death experience my grandson is two and his name is Cole and my son's name is David but in this scene Cole's five and I'm sitting next to my son David in these bleachers out on a soccer field and Cole he's running up and down this soccer field and the sun's glinting off his hair and he's smiling and he's gregarious and interacting with everybody so alive you know my son looks at me he says Mom I'm G to be the dad to him that I deserved and in that moment I realized that with my kids God was breaking this generational curse of absent fathers from my husband's side and I'm like wait what and he's like the

1:08:00

children in your family from here forward will not suffer that curse anymore oh I've chills and I was like my gosh what do you mean you mean my grandchildren my great-grandchildren their grandchildren it's broken and he's like it's broken it's broken I feel like this is such a testament to you to for it to be this sort of generational curse it's like well why didn't the generation above me or two above me why didn't you fix it there but it's you as their mom and the experiences you could provide them willing people that's it you can't work through unwilling people God does not intercede against our will but I was willing I was willing I'm like and I just saw that I saw these generations and generations with these interactive dads and and my son he's such a good dad oh that's so special it's so special you know he had broken that curse and when he showed me that I mean how do you not fall in love with that God you just can't it yeah and also how do you not

1:09:00

decide to go back and stay so you can witness that and be a part of that right right but also part of me would want to stay with this God and be like well show me all the other incredible right right yeah I love this movie right right let's just keep doing this this is incredible it's all going to work out with or without me he shows me that and I'm that hurt is healed in me like immediately I could see it like a physical wound and there wasn't even a scar it was just perfect and I in that moment surrendered to God and so this part of this light comes off of him it starts swirling around my feet comes in through my toes up through my calves and my knees my thighs up into my middle and when it gets in my middle it starts spinning around like this like a cloak and it's healing all those visceral wounds from childhood on and I can just feel those things being settled it goes up it goes around my heart and I can just feel it changing softening my heart making me not so hard and not so scared and not

1:10:00

walled up anymore and then it comes up and it gets in the back of my throat it hits my tongue and my tongue lights up with singing and I'm a horrible singer horrible and it's just I'm like oh my gosh I want to take this back if I go back this is incredible and then it comes up It Gets behind my eyes and I could feel it kind of in my brain and I didn't want to let it out because it was just euphoric yeah and so I squeeze my eyes shut to keep keep it in and it shines out through my eyelashes and it hits the light of God around me and then it rushes back in and it starts going through all the Curves in my brain and lights up areas of my brain that did not work as well here I knew everything but I knew I wouldn't be able to remember it but in that moment I knew all the things that God let me know and so when we get through that part he puts out his hand and it was like a hand and he takes my hand and we start flying and we're going around the SP of my DNA and we're just looking at everything that's pieced me together all the ancestry that's gone

1:11:00

into it all the history all the stories you know and I'm just knowing them and he gets to this one part it's called Junk DNA and I've never heard of it but you can look it up junk DNA it's part of your DNA that nobody knows what it does unless they figured it out since I last read about it but he says do you see me and I'm like do I see you yes you're everywhere I mean I can't not see you everything and he's like no and he points to the DNA and he's like do you see me and I look and I see his fingerprints and I'm like what and that's when he says you can say that your father is not your father and you can believe it and you can say it your whole life but right here we could prove it couldn't we and we'd know who is your father it's the same with me people can deny me and people can say that I'm not their God I'm not their father but the proof is right here I'm right here and of course we label it as junk

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DNA yeah that's we don't know what that does so it must be junk I love that oh that's trash disregard that don't think about that just pull that out of the DNA it's probably no good anyway so I in that moment I know I have to decide whether to stay or go and I want to stay but I realize that I have so not lived that I have such an impact to make that it would be shameful not to go back yeah but I was knew I wasn't going to be judged for it I could stay and it was going to be okay the kids were going to be okay everyone was going to be okay because eventually we all get there anywhere this is over in a Flash you have no idea how fast this is over and so I'm like I got to go back and so as I think that God starts separating getting further and further going back to his place and I'm being pulled back to mine and I shout I'm like wait wait wait wait wait and he stops and I'm like let me remember it if you don't let me remember it I won't have any hope and so

Returning to life

I wake up I'm in the hospital bed I'm off the ventilator there's a little old nurse sitting next to me and she's like oh well hello there honey you're back

1:13:00

and I say I was with God that's your first I was busy I'm so glad that like you you were able to remember all of this yeah yeah well especially because when you moved into the astral state from your physical body once you went through that anaphylaxis and whatnot like there was the confusion there was the lack of memory from what had just happened and the fact that immediately like your very first thought getting back into your body it's not confusion like what happened I'm groggy it's the memory of what just happened that is that's incredible it's just like if you met a famous person you know you're like oh my gosh you know who I just met who I sat next to on the plane and it's whoever this person is but this was God it so much bigger but it's also so beautiful that you have retained these memories and are able to share it like it's almost like a purpose that you were now given is to share this with people to share this with the world and with your family and with us and with our listeners yeah it really is so beautiful that was the thing so I come back and the nurse is like I'm like no really I

1:14:00

was just with God and she's like oh honey let me go get your family and she puts in a psych consult and I'm like a psych consult I'm in a faith-based hospital are you kidding me if you guys can't believe this who will believe it yeah and also you just went through a lot so let's not let's not make evaluations right away give me a minute I just opened my eyes from a 5day coma and so my sister comes in and I'm like I saw what you wrote on Facebook hang kiddo I'm coming I couldn't get it out fast enough yeah you're like I need to prove this too and she was like what what and I had seen her sitting in this waiting room that I was unfamiliar with even though I'd worked at that hospital and worked in that ICU and I saw her sitting in the waiting room with my son she had her purse between them she had blue Kleenex in her purse and they were talking about um had I made clear to anybody what my wishes were about being kept alive on life support and that conversation actually took place and she actually had blue Kleenex in her purse there's no way I could have known that or what my daughter was wearing or any of the other things that have been verified and so the nurse ran everybody off she's like she's really worked up

1:15:00

she needs to settle down you know she's still critical and so she ran everybody off and they finally turned the lights off in that ICU room and pulled the curtains so that I could try to sleep you do not wake up rested from a coma I if anybody has any misgivings you feel like crap like you've been run over by a truck right and so I'm there she pulls the curtain she walks out I'm in there for a while and I'm just kind of thinking about everything and all of a sudden this light pops into the corner of the room scares the crap out of me and I scream and God laughs and so when he laughs I laugh and I'm like what are you doing you scared the crap out of me and I'm like I didn't know you were here and he's like I'm always here and I'm like but not like that you pop into rooms and so he laughs and he says I I want to give you this message and I want you to share it with the world and so I'm like I hope it's short you know I've got propal in my system I'm not going to remember crap and so he told it all to me and then he left and then I didn't get a pen till the next day to write it down but I was able to write it word for word and so he told me to share it with the world and so I didn't because it was the most beautiful thing anybody had

1:16:00

ever written to me and I just held on to it so I went on to have 17 more episodes of respiratory failure before we figured out what was wrong with me and then when they figured it out they're like here's the deal people generally either snap out of it in two and a half or three years or they die there's just nothing

Integrating the experience

and I was like okay so the last time I went into anaphylaxis I I passed out of my body again and was with God and I told him I said I'm done you know either heal me or keep me I can't keep doing this to me to my family and he said it's not me it's you like what do you mean it's not you and he said Penny you were going to go back and you were going to influence people you were going to change lives you were going to love people and I keep putting people and situations in your path and you keep saying no you said you wanted to live right you said you wanted to live but you won't take any of these opportunities and I'm like well I'm dying every other day what do you want me to do I said that and he said you start saying yes and I saidou telling me that if I

1:17:00

start saying yes this is going to stop and he's like yes and I'm like okay that's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard but you're God so I'll give it a try so I get home from the hospital my friend Brian that I know through the near-death experience Community calls me and like he' called me a million times or messaged me a million times to ask me to speak to their group I'd made up something or lied every time because of my social anxiety and I said yes and he's like what and I'm like just stop talking to me now or I'm going to think of a reason not to do it and so I did that talk I've done every talk since I've not had another episode of anaphylaxis all my labs like my my eosinophils were 10,000 they're not supposed to be over 300 10,000 you can't even get meds because you're they're too high for you to qualify for the meds to treat it and they're like 40 now with no treatment oh my gosh it's wild that it was like could God not have given a sign that was a little less drastic than like nearly killing you many more times I'm that kind of person though I mean you're really I used to pray this is not God's

1:18:00

fault I used to pray I'm like God if you need me to see something or do something I actually prayed this prayer please drop a load of bricks on my head because I won't see it otherwise and when I met my husband the first date we went on I told him the story and he' printed out a bunch of bricks and colored them and put them in the visor so we met for lunch but then he's like hey let's go do this or something and I got in his car and when I pulled the visor down all those bricks fell on me oh my God you got to marry that guy right love wow absolutely oh my gosh that's it I've got the message from God I'll read to you because I'm supposed to read it and I don't want to get in trouble yeah you're supposed to share it right don't let him uh kill you again he told me it would be theft if I didn't share it so so you guys are both sometimes intense and Theatrical with your messaging to each other yeah God really put me on the path that I meant to be on CU I would have never seen me podcasting but here I am so here was his message such Folly to

1:19:00

think anything escapes my knowing as when you were with me all at once all that I allowed you to know you knew no words were spoken nor were they shouted I whispered them to your spirit I discreetly filled you with knowing knowing flowed into you as effortlessly as taking a breath is it not so The Great I Am no trer words have ever been spoken or written The Great I Am is in your core The Great I Am is the light even when I am Hidden Still I am as my energy charged sending me over each syapse in your brain even those small fibers knew that I am they Rose and fell to the Rhythm I created to the symphony I composed I conducted I consider it a tragic comedy of arrogance when man denies what the smallest inovation knows man thinks he acts and moves outside my knowledge how could it be so I say I

1:20:00

Proclaim he does not his own fibers clutch themselves laughing at the idea I am the flower the wind the rain the senu the marrow the rock the author the maker the touch that set in motion all that you see all that you know and all that you do not see or know I knit you I put breath in you you I am coded in every cell every nanc of time falls and step as I will it so I am in you I am in you I am all even when you perceive nothing still I am there as I tell you this here and now pressing my truth into your breast your very heart presses it further in so that what you will how are you able to remember that yeah truly my question that is impressive know what's funny is I was able to remember it straight out of a coma the next day but I can't I have to read it now it's

1:21:00

because you needed to write it down he he needed you to write it down yeah but you'd think it would be I mean I've read it a million times but I think it's written down so I can read it because it ministers to me too yeah yeah so that's it that's it that's it as if this wasn't like the most wled and dazzling and and there's so much more also and I know that you have spent a lot of time sharing your story with the world so can you tell our listeners how they can find more from you your podcast and other interviews that you can guide them to to hear more about your story you can just look up Penny Whit wrote w ttb r o DT it on YouTube you put that in you're going to get a ton of videos incredible I also have a channel on YouTube it's called life from a near-death perspective but I all my podcasts go there so it's not always that I have a book club on Wednesday morning morning it's on Rumble and it's also on YouTube on Rumble you just go to rumble.com and search nurse

1:22:00

Penney and I do a Wednesday morning show where I read books to people and and talk about them and then Friday nights we do kind of a current event show and then once a month on Saturdays we do girls night out which is just foolishness we will be tuning in yeah and you can go to wit wi Health coaching no wait wh Health coaching we'll link also in our show notes I'll send it to you um so that's my web page and people can message me if they need prayer or struggling with something I answer all emails um it takes me a little bit because I get a lot okay well I have one final question for you this is gonna seem so out of left field but I feel like we have heard stories of people's near-death experiences so many different people's and one of the weird things that comes out of certain people's experiences is that they talk about seeing Elvis have you heard that I have not but I don't read of I had my experience 11 years ago and I have read two near-death experience books and I was in both of them and I try not to read other other

1:23:00

people's near-death experiences or watch them because I'm still sorting and processing mine even this many years out and I don't want it colored by anything okay well then we won't say anymore okay so no Elvis well no you can tell me about Elvis I I feel like I could sort out that wasn't for me he's apparently the most seen figure in near-death experiences yeah are you K where are you getting this information I think celebrity interet God like I think Elvis is the most seen celebrity I know all kinds of experiencers and I've never met anyone who's met Elvis how cool would that be I know it's so odd we're like what is Elvis doing like why why did he choose that it would have been cool I mean man if I could sit down with all this how awesome would that be he's like guess what I'm gonna sing One for the Money again no please stop well Penny this has been such a delight to speak with you yeah thank you so much it was super fun it's such a rare treat for us too that we actually get to hear the stories that

1:24:00

we cover from the person who experienced them when you guys did such okay look I don't listen to near-death experiences and I was listening to something not nde related and you guys came up and I'm like oh they're cute and so I stopped and you were telling my story and I'm like what wild I never met these girls I listened to the whole thing and I'm like I gained so much perspective from you guys actually s through some things oh wow thanks it did because you were giving your perspective like I could hear it without me being involved and me having to be on you know and thinking and it was I could just be totally passive and take it in and hear it from someone else and it just it crystallized so many things for me and you guys are just um entertaining anyway you're silly and cute well thank you we think you are as well you have such a a way about you and it's very beautiful to hear your story well thank you thank you for sharing your story with us and with all of our listeners happy I'm sure we will speak

1:25:00

again I'm sure we will much love to you guys bye see Bye by very SP