PARANORMAL INVESTIGATOR TELLS ALL | Alex LeMay’s Wildest Encounters

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We are so excited for today's guest.

We are beyond excited for today's guest. Alex Lameé is an icon in the paranormal space and also we loved her from afar for many

for a long time.

But when we spoke with her, Kurt and I think fell in love with her and want to be her best friend and want to do paranormal investigations with her all the time or be a haunted doll in her collection.

She's just the coolest. She's so kind and she makes paranormal equipment

and does a lot of investigations. This is a really fun episode and we hope you enjoy it as much as we enjoyed recording it. Yeah,

very spooky.

welcome Alex LeMay

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Hello. Hi, Alice.

Hello. Hi.

We're so glad you're here.

Thanks for having me.

You feel like a paranormal celebrity to us. So,

because we saw you on TV.

Yes. And then we were like, "Oh my god, we're obsessed." And then I also watch all of your Instagrams and all your videos. And every time you just sit on the floor and talk to ghosts, I'm like, I'm glued in.

Oh, I love that. Oh my gosh, it's crazy to hear from you guys cuz I'm also just as obsessed.

I love all of your episodes and everything. And when you asked me to be on here, I was like, "Oh my god, I' I've made it." You know,

it felt like that.

Well, it goes both ways.

Yeah. I feel like we were learning a lot from you without you knowing that we're learning from you, but now we're going to all learn together with you here.

Yes. I love that.

To start out, how did you get into investigating the paranormal? Are you haunted? Have you always been haunted? Tell us everything.

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That's a good It's a good way to put it. I have always been haunted. It's true. It used to just be thinking that I had imaginary friends. I think a lot of us have similar stories where we had imaginary friends and they weren't actually imaginary friends. Yeah.

Yeah. And that kind of just went into around high school where I was like, "Okay, I'm I'm not seeing things that aren't there." Because at this point, I had had experiences where I'd seen someone's grandmother who was no longer living and they were able to say, "Oh, well, that sounds a lot like my grandmother." So, I knew something was going on. And once I got to high school, I was so obsessed. I would have sleepovers where we would just play with talking boards and we would do candle magic and investigate my very haunted house at the time. So, it's just kind of always been there. It's just always been haunted.

Wait. Okay. Can we hear a little bit about your imaginary friends?

Yeah. Oh my gosh. This first one that I had, I think we moved into this apartment complex when I was around six

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and we walked in and I heard this guy say, "Hey, Alex." Like in a very deep voice. So, when you're little, that's so freaky. And I remember crying and my dad was like, "Oh, it's okay. It's okay. What did you hear?" And I was like, "There's a man in the house. Like, we can't. There's someone already living here." Even though there clearly wasn't,

right?

But we moved in and I only remember bits and pieces, but what I do remember is that he was this really tall man. He had he was a darker complexion and he wore a turban and he had a really long beard. And it was very specific to um from what I've learned is seek people. So it's something that as a six-year-old I would not have any experience with. So he was there all the time and he was very nice to me and uh when I had bad days he would like sit down and be like, "Oh, why are you having a bad day? Can I do anything for you?"

Oh my gosh. Wait, this is so nice.

Yeah, he was very kind to me.

I need one of those right now. Well, I also love that the second you

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guys you got into that apartment, he knew who you were and was excited and greeting you.

Yeah. And it feels like that's happened my whole life. I feel like I walk into spaces and they're typically pretty nice and they're like, "Oh, hey, let's chat. Like, now that you're here, I want to tell you my life story." Or usually they're nice. I do have some like experiences with creepier, scarier ghosts. They're they're all just as excited, unfortunately. But the nice ones are also there, which I like to focus on a little bit and remind myself that they're not all bad.

So, does anyone else in your family experience this as well?

Um, from what I've heard, my dad did when he was younger. My sister does a little bit. I think it happens to me the most because I've leaned into it so much. I'm so curious as to what's going on. Those experiences lit this fire in me where it's all I think about now. I'm like obsessed, which I'm sure you guys get. Oh, absolutely. So, would you say your I guess like what would you call or qualify yourself as? Do you have any

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Claire's? Are you psychic, a medium? How do you identify? I just call myself sensitive.

Say I'm sensitive to spirit because it's a good umbrella term. I haven't really put myself into any like boxes or descriptors cuz I'm I wouldn't consider myself a full-on medium since that's not right what I'm doing. But I do see spirit occasionally, not all the time.

ghost or intruder?

Have you ever had a situation where you walked into a place and you couldn't tell that they were spirit, but they were spirit? Like at first they

once or twice?

Really?

Yeah. That doesn't happen now that I'm older. I think that happens to you. From what I've researched, I think that happens to us mainly when we're going through puberty and we have a lot of emotions within us. And the more emotions we carry, I think that feeds them to a degree so they can manifest to us more,

right?

And so when I was in high school, I saw a lot where I was like, "Are you alive or are you not alive?" And it would only

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happen for like maybe 60 seconds and then I would realize that they weren't actually alive. But I've had moments like that.

60 seconds is a long time.

That is a long time. And I do have a story of this house that I was in when I was a teenager where that happened with a friend here and it was the first time a friend had witnessed it and it was so scary that we ended up calling the cops.

We thought a real person was in the house.

And the cops showed up and they were like, "There's no one here." Well, do you want to hear the story?

Yes, absolutely.

So, we had a sleepover. We were doing our normal thing and we walked across the street to go get snacks, came back and we opened the door and realized that the bathroom door was shut. The light was on and the faucet was on. So, being home alone, we were like, that's crazy. Like, there's obviously someone broke in here and I was like me thinking, I know it's haunted. Maybe it's just a ghost. So, I got on all fours and I looked under the thing and I could see two boots. Like, there was a pair of boots underneath the door. So, all you saw was this glow from it and these boots. And I

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got quiet and I looked to my friend and I was like, "Someone's here. Someone broke in. We need to call 911." So the faucet's still going. You can still see the boots. My friend runs out the front door and goes to the neighbors and calls 911. And I'm standing there just like do I run?

Is a man going to kill me? Because there's so many things that go in your mind like, "Did somebody break in? Is it a ghost?" Because at the time things had been happening. Like the garage door would open and close. The doors would open and close. So, I was on the fence with whatever it could have been. Then his feet disappeared and Kelly, my friend, came running in and I was like, I I think it's a ghost. I don't see him anymore. And she's like, oh, he's standing on the toilet. So, we're like freaking out. And then the faucet turns off and the cops arrive and we're like freaking out at this point thinking that there really is a man in there. The cops arrive, they open the door and there's no one in there. Like there was no one in there and there's no way they could have jumped out the window because the window is too small for a man in booze,

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right? And you've been standing outside of the door like you know no one's left.

Yeah. So it was this experience where

it had to have been a ghost. I still don't know. I still don't know.

That's wild. And the cops looked at us like

that's also so scary to be in that like sort of in between where you're like okay well I've been experiencing a lot so could this be a spirit or is this because then you're you're standing there like what if it really was someone and they open the door.

Yeah. I was preparing myself. I was like what could I grab to hit him with? Like I was prepared to fight back but ended up being a ghost.

We say this all the time like the paranormal can be so scary but people are way scarier.

Way scarier.

Oh for sure. What? That's what kept me there is thinking it was a ghost. If I really thought it was a guy, I think I would have hight tailed it out of there,

right?

But I was on the fence. I was like, "Something weird. Something weird's happening."

I do like that you had a witness like it wasn't you by yourself.

Yeah, it was pretty fun. It was fun to

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have someone else there. I've had that happen one other time and we all I don't know. I still contact them sometimes and I'm like, "You remember when this happened?" And we always have this like collective nostalgic moment where we're like, "Yeah."

And now you do that all the time.

Yeah. So, what what does your day-to-day life look like?

Um, you know, I'm I'm sitting in a room with haunted dolls on the wall over here. And there's one in a jar here on my desk. You know, she's got some weird energy to her. I think I'm obsessed is a good way to put it. I also have a a side business that I've ran forever. It's called Moon Goddess Market where it used to be more of a witchcraft supply store

and now it's more just my art, but I've always had one hand in something metaphysical or strange. So, if it's not full-time ghost hunting, then it's making art or practicing witchcraft or

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talking to people who have like attachments and they want advice, things like that. It engulfs my dayto-day. So, it's been really nice. I enjoy it.

I would love to just be a fly on the wall of your life. I know.

Yeah. Actually, come on over. You're welcome to come by anytime.

Like, when I die, I would love to be a haunted object in your possession.

I'd be really nice to you. How do you go

collecting haunted objects

about finding the objects?

You know what? I don't seek them out.

Really? They find you?

Yeah.

Yeah. I don't know if they find me or what the deal is because before I started owning a few of these, I never saw them anywhere. I feel like it's very hard to find anything that is truly haunted. And I came upon this doll in this weird estate sale that had all of the pictures of her life. Like there was a photo from the early 1900s of the little girl and the doll that I had purchased at the time

and that was my first real haunted object where I was like, "Oh, I didn't think anything of it. I thought she was

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really pretty." But I started having dreams and I got the spirit box out and thought it was just residual. It wasn't anything truly intelligent until she started answering me in intelligent ways where I was like, "Oh, this

this really is something, you know?"

Yeah. And since then, I think I'm drawn to it in a way that maybe I'm not even aware of because I don't go out thinking I'm going to go find a haunted doll or I'm going to find a haunted talking board or Ouija board, right?

It just has happened. And now I've got four of them in my possession that I think two of them are just residual energy, but the other two are kind of intense

and they're in little boxes and I'm very nice to them. As long as they're nice to me, everything's fine.

Boundaries. Mhm.

Yes. Boundaries are very important when they're in your possession.

Right. So, you said you have four in your home right now.

Yeah. Two are in the garage.

Two are in the garage.

Are those the ones that are nice to you or the ones that are a little scary?

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They're the intense ones. I leave them out there, you know? Yeah.

It's a good boundary. It's a good physical boundary. The other two can hang out in here.

One of them, she's in this cute little case I just got her. You want to see her? Should I get her? Yeah, of course. That chair is also amazing.

I know.

Thank you. I love it. My throne.

It literally is a throne.

This is her in her new little case.

Oh, she's so darling.

Isn't she?

The case is so pretty.

Yeah. So, she can be in here cuz we don't have any beef. Everything's fine. She has this I don't know. She's so sweet. There she is.

That kind of freed me up. You said hello.

I was like, "Oh, she's so sweet. touches her head and she says hello and then her eyes go hello.

Yeah.

Does she have a name?

No, I haven't asked her her name yet. Or she hasn't told me yet. I think I have asked. She has a baby blanket that she asked for.

She asked for a baby blanket.

So special.

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She asked for a baby blanket. So she has that in there with her. I don't know her story. She hasn't really told me much in the sessions that I've done with her.

Yeah. The only thing that's spooky that has told me that she might be haunted is she's typically on the shelf right here.

And uh I'll put her in a position that's, you know, I remember that's where she was. And the next thing her head will be this way

or her head will be that way. But she's been moving around a lot. She's doing some stuff. So now she's got a cute little box.

Okay. I have a question. So Karina and I, and I'll say specifically me because they're being kept at my home, are I have also created boundaries.

The boundary is

Sabrina, you take them home with you. Um

well, my child is like he walks into our office, which is where we record.

Yeah.

And this is like the only place in our in my house that he like gets really spooked and will scream some encounters here.

So yeah, I'm like, we can't add hauntings into my home where there's already stuff going on. But okay, my

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question is, so we've started to bring in haunted objects and I do feel drawn to some items, but I feel guilty like bringing them to into my house like I'll have a conversation with them and I'll talk to them, but how often should you be interacting with them? And also like how do you say, "Hey, like if you want to communicate, here's a sign that you can give to me so I know you need like attention." Like I feel like they're children and they are spirits. Like I want to make sure that they feel safe and happy that they're emotionally fulfilled.

I'm also I hardly have time for me like I'm like how much time should I be allotting to them?

I mean that's a good question. I think a lot of it is intuitive and how you feel. If you're feeling very drawn to them. I think that that is the main way that they speak to us or communicate with us is those feelings. Yeah,

this one in particular, I had her for maybe 6 months before I ever communicated with her just to feel things out. I'll look for different

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signs like if I'm having nightmares and then I'll know, okay, this is or you know that feeling you get where you're uneasy. If that starts happening, then I'll put some boundaries down. I'll get them a little box just to protect myself, keep myself,

you know, in a safe space where I'm not getting my energy drained or putting myself in bad situations,

right?

Because I think it, you know, a lot of people are like, "Oh, well,

none of this is real. I don't believe in it." And that in itself can give you protections because if you're not looking at it, it's not looking at you back.

Sure.

So, I think people don't have to worry if they don't believe in it. It's fine. But if you are looking and you are trying to perceive something like that, I think you do open doors to it without maybe even being intentional. And I always tell people that speaking it out loud is like the best way to help control that situation. I'm very absolute in what I say. I haven't done it in a while, but when I bring something new in, I'll say, "Hey, my name is Alex. This is my room. You're

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only allowed in this space." And uh I'll usually set boundaries based off of the room. So, if it's in my room, I'll be like, "You're only allowed in this space. You can't affect my energy. You can't use my energy. You can't um use anybody else's energy." If I have roommates, I'll just set a bunch of boundaries down. And I'll say that every single day until it feels very solidified in that space cuz

I think if you speak something enough, it becomes reality. And I know it's been shown in different studies like with Amy Brunie. She did this. Have you heard of the zombie boy episode with Amy Brunie where they tested No.

They tested this theory about spirits and being able to kind of program them with information and seeing if they could get that back almost like how egregor work where you can create it. And they did some experiments where they went in and they said, "Uh, my wife died at this." I don't know exact the exact details. You'll have to watch it, but it's something along the lines of them giving the exact day of death, what their wife's name was, and they said

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that collectively and then went in and asked those questions and got those questions in response through the spirit box. So, they were giving the information and receiving. So, it was like they were programming it.

It's like conjuring Phillip.

Yeah. They were like programming it. And I think about that a lot when it comes to my investigations where I'm like, we have so much power in our spoken word,

whatever it is that's happening. So, I'm always I always say it out loud. I'm like, "Here's my boundaries. This is what you're allowed to do, what you're not allowed to do."

But I think it's just all intuition. I think if you feel that pull to communicate and connect,

then go right ahead and see how it goes. But, um, also tune in to your gut and see how you feel. Because if you get that uneasy feeling, then it's best to set some really strong boundaries and maybe even take them and put them in the garage like I do.

Yeah.

Okay. That like leads to another question is like have you ever had to rehome a haunted object and how do you go about that if something is crossing

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boundaries or it's not a good

scaring you? Yeah. What do you do?

I had one doll that I didn't think was haunted. I turned into a re pod. So I like ripped her head off and I drilled a hole down the middle of her skull and so gruesome. just mutilated her.

Oh my gosh.

Totally. So, I'm like on my desk. I'm cutting her head open. I'm like drilling things in and putting electronics in her body and I burned myself really bad and I was like, "Oh my gosh, what was that?" So, didn't think anything of it. That always happens, right? Well, it doesn't always happen, but it was weird. And then I dropped something and I was like, "What is going on?" Like, so many bad things started happening all during this short time span of me putting an antenna in her head. So, I pick up my phone to start recording to see if I could get some EVP activity or something. And I pick her up and my phone my phone flies out of my hand shatters. Like, I had just bought the phone. And I was like, "Okay, I don't know what this means. I'm

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just going to put her head back on cuz it's too late. Like, I can't take all of this out." So, I put everything back on her and um I turned it on and it starts going off like crazy. Like, I thought maybe I had built it wrong cuz it was it wouldn't stop. And I was like, "This is this is wild." Like, "This wouldn't stop." My glue gun fell off and then burnt a hole in my carpet all in this like short little period of me freaking out. So, I turned her off and I sat her down and I just looked at her and I was like, "What have I done?"

And she was so mad at me for that that it took a long time.

The beheaded. Yeah.

Yeah.

I mean, she just she was there like enjoying watching you. Thought she had this peaceful little life just like quietly observing and then gets mutilated. turned into Frankenstein

so bad. She was big mad. Like

that was a betrayal on your part. You didn't trusted you.

You didn't know.

I didn't know. And you know, I sat down and I was like, "But you're so cool now. Like, I just gave you upgrades. If anything, you should be thanking me.

Now you can communicate with people."

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But I ended up giving her to a friend and we had to ship her in a bunch of salt and in a box. And I all I've heard is that she's been nothing but spicy since then. So

Oh. Oh no.

I think the act of packing it away, saying goodbye in itself is good enough cuz you really are physically

taking them and putting them somewhere and saying goodbye. And that worked for me. I haven't had any attachment to her whatsoever since then. But she's having a great life now.

Oh my gosh. Now I want you to like revisit her and then put her in a Barbie Jeep or something so that she can drive herself around now too.

Like she's gonna drive to Alex show up at your front door.

I don't know. Give her a dream house.

That's actually my dream. If that would happen, I would be so happy. I do have a remote control car that I put them in that says Paranormal Alex on the side.

It's so fun. It's a van, so I could put more than one in there.

Oh my god. I You're making me

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spooky Miss Frile. You're making me want to be a haunted doll in your possession so badly.

Can we have fun?

You never know what Alex is going to do. Field trip. You're like the like very positive fun version of Sid in Toy Story.

The paranormal Sid. Okay. So, when you have these items, like I I think it's clear you do a good job of explaining what's going on and setting boundaries and they live with you, but do you ever take them with you on investigations? Ooh, that's a good question.

Yeah, I have this one that I put a like a night sensor. It's a IR sensor. It can see in pitch darkness and it speaks. So, it's got like six words in her. And she's a little I'm iffy about her being on the intelligent side of haunting, more residual. So, weird stuff just happens with her and she's huge. She's like this big.

Whoa. But I bring her with me to investigations and she's fun. I love her, but I don't know what her deal is. She's always fallen over and I've had to

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glue her face back together so many times because of that. Like,

oh my god,

bless her heart. You know, like I set her up and you could not push her over when I set her up. Like I make sure because it's a pain in the butt to have to glue her face back together. But every time I put her

up against the wall, I'll be in another room and they'll I have footage of her on the stove sitting there

and then I walk away and she just head plants into the stove and it's so loud. I'm like, "Oh my gosh." And she does that all the time.

Maybe she wants a new face. She wants an upgrade.

Yeah. What does this say about her? Stick her in a new wig. Maybe she'll feel herself a little bit more with like a new dew or something. Yeah, maybe she wants a faceelift, some new hair. That's a good idea.

A new look.

She's definitely going through something. I've stopped bringing her places cuz she's just so dramatic.

It's a lot of work for you.

Says a few words and smashes her face open. Like that is very dramatic.

Poor girl.

You can hear it in the other room and

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then there's like she's got a porcelain face and you can see all these pieces.

NOCD

I feel like OCD is such a misunderstood diagnosis.

It absolutely is. And I would know because when I was 14 years old, I had to go to therapy for my OCD and learn all of the ways to cope with it. And I feel like the way it's portrayed in media and how people are always like, "Oh my god, you're so OCD." I'm like, "Haha, yeah." But that is not what OCD is.

No. OCD is a very serious and highly misunderstood condition. And we're grateful that we are partnered with NOCD because it feels like there's now a place for people to go to get treatment.

Mhm. So, one of the things people with OCD might experience are your good old intrusive thoughts. Like, for example, when I became a mom, I was obsessed with the idea that I was going to fall down the stairs or just throw my child down the stairs, which was not at all a possibility, but it was just like all consuming. It's overwhelming. But with the right kind of help from a specialized therapist who truly

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understands what you're experiencing and is trained to treat it, OCD is extremely manageable. And at NOCD, every therapist deeply understands OCD. Plus, NOCD accepts most major insurance plans and is covered for over 155 million Americans. NOCD makes sure that you are supported between sessions with powerful in-app tools such as therapist messaging and communities. If you're ready to get help from a therapist who truly understands OCD, visit nocd.com to book a free call. That's noocd.com.

Alex's favorite paranormal encounter

So, you have gone to so many different haunted places and you've also investigated. I mean, it sounds like the paranormal just follows you and shows up to you. So, it doesn't have to be necessarily a haunted location to do an investigation, but of all the places you have been, we'd love to hear your favorite and why. And then the scariest place you've been to.

Oo. Okay. My favorite, I think, must have been one of those turning points in life when I was around 12. I was staying

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the night at my friend's house and we were home alone at the time cuz her mom worked nights and she didn't get home until like 4:00 a.m. So, we were sleeping and I woke up cuz I kept hearing somebody in the kitchen thinking that, "Oh, her mom's home and her mom always brought snacks." So, I got up and I was like, "Yes, we're getting some snacks." But her mom actually wasn't home. I saw who I thought was her standing in the hallway and it was a little strange cuz she didn't say anything and it was all dark. No, the lights were on. And so I just stood there and looked back at her trying to figure out, is this her mom or not her mom,

right?

And she continued to walk around the corner. And so I followed her a little bit. And I remember hearing the door lock. It was before I had seen her turn the corner and caught up to her. So the door locked. You could hear it. And I came around the corner and there was nobody there. And I remember thinking, "This house isn't very big. Like where would she have gone?

Why are all the lights out? That's strange." and she usually turns them on when she gets home. So, I'm slowly

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walking back down the hallway trying to figure out where her mom went and I get back to our room and I wake my friend up and I'm like, I think there's somebody in the house and I thought it was your mom. I don't know what's going on. So, she wakes up and we see the silhouette of who I think is her mom again turn a corner. So, we're both trying to figure out what's going on. Her mom is not home. This is something else. And then the door starts violently shaking and it's somebody trying to break in and we're young at the time. It was totally terrifying and we didn't know what to do. So we go into her room and we lock the door and we're

freaking out.

We're trying to stay quiet. The shaking continues. It's it gives me goosebumps thinking about it because we were so scared. And then her mom gets home. I think it was just a couple hours later and we're like, "Did you come home earlier? We don't know what happened. Somebody was trying to break in. Like you could see the frame of the door had been shaken loose. Like it was starting to come off because they had tried to

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get in.

Oh my god.

And she was like, "What happened?" And we were like, "We don't know. We saw this something that looked like you walking around the house and they locked the door and then disappeared." And she said, "Well, that's likely my mom." Cuz I guess her mom looked like her. So we saw her grandmother, her grandmother who had passed walking around who locked the door right before someone had tried to break in. And it was I think that was this pinnacle moment for me.

Chills all over my body.

Right. Me too. Every time I talk about it

constantly. Yeah.

So it was this moment in my life that changed everything. Yeah. I think that is what put me on this path of becoming a paranormal investigator. Yeah.

And taking it seriously because being able to manifest in that way to lock the door for all of that to happen the way that it did. I was curious forever after that. I just could not ask enough questions. And every time I got one question answered, I had more and it's

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just been never ending.

I know. I feel like that's the biggest thing in the eight years that we've done this podcast. you know, we came in and started with a very small I guess like we just had one perspective and then now over the years we have way more questions than when we started which is cool.

You just keep getting deeper and deeper into it.

Yeah. I'm just I'm like still amazed by that story being saved by a spirit and witnessing it like consciously knowing that you are because it also makes me wonder like you know how many times do we have some sort of spiritual intervention that's helping us through life or saving us from certain things and we don't recognize it because it's either not obvious or we just weren't aware. But like that is such a powerful example and it also just like made my mind go to oh my god how scary for that person. We recently read an email from a listener where someone's was it a grandmother?

It was an aunt.

An aunt. There was an intruder or like

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someone creeping around the property and the spirit of the aunt like grabbed the guy from outside and actually dragged him into the haunted house

and did like a bunch of poltergeist activity to like scare the [ __ ] out of this guy until the police came.

Yeah. Wow.

Like plucked the guy from outside and was like, "You're coming in with me."

And now I'm just I like pictured the grandma just like ready for this to save save these young girls. Well, because there's also think about how many other ways that this could have happened. You could have slept through it.

You like maybe you didn't see her spirit at all and you just heard the shaking of the door. Like it happened in a way that I feel like set you up down this path too.

It totally did. And I think about that all the time. How many of us have experienced that without waking up like somebody, a guardian

or an ancestor that stays with us and continues to help us.

It's a really cool moment to have because I really do feel like we're not alone. And a lot of us have that question, what happens after we die? And

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we think about our loved ones and how scary it is to think we'll never see them again. But these experiences that I've had have helped me feel a little bit at ease where I do like I've lost my father. I feel like he's with me all the time now. And

yeah.

Yeah. I think that happens to a lot of us and we don't even know cuz if I didn't wake up then we would have just been protected and we would have thought that we would remember to lock the door when we actually didn't.

Yeah. Wow.

It's pretty cool.

It is very cool. Okay. Now, what's the

Alex's scariest encounter

scariest?

The scariest? I've had so many scary ones happen. It's hard to decide. You can share as many scary ones as you want. I'm I'm I want to hear your scary stories.

I have funny scary and then I have actual scary scary.

Okay, do scary scary first.

Okay, scary scary must have been Waverly Hills. That was one of my favorite places.

That is like top of our bucket list.

Is it? You have to go.

Yeah, because we're so scared of it.

But draw the scariest place to go.

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It freaked me out. There's so much activity there and they have a haunted house in where the morg used to be. Like they just know exactly what they're doing, you know?

Damn.

But I had an experience there. Well, this was on my show, Living for the Dead, the episode, which I think it was called, oh gosh, it had a funny name and I already forgot it. It was something cute, but it was Waverly Hills. And I had this idea where I wanted to go completely alone to the area where they stored the bodies. So, you know those

God, you're so brave. wall. Thank you. Those things in the wall you pull out and have the bodies in them. They had a couple of those

and I wanted to go by myself and just crawl into one of those and hang out and see what would happen.

Oh my gosh.

Oh jeez, that is way further than I thought you were going to take it. I thought you were just going to stand there.

No, I climbed in. I grabbed my gear. I wanted some answers because at the time the keeper of the place had been telling us that they were getting hundreds of

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attachments from this location. people were going home and things were following them.

Gosh.

So, we were trying to get answers as to why that was happening. And I I was so deeply curious about attachments in general because I haven't really experienced that many and I don't know a lot of people that have experienced that many attachments themselves. So, to hear that number was astonishing.

Yeah.

So, I went straight to the place that people said that they got these attachments, which is the haunted house. And I thought the creepiest place has got to be where they held the bodies. So I climbed in in pitch darkness.

I had a re pod above my head over here and I was just laying there like for dramatic effect.

Yeah, of course. Like a dead body.

Yeah, of course. And I started asking the entity there. I asked, you know, are you malevolent? And the device goes off. And what I thought was super, this is so nerdy of me, but I love the fact that it the re pod was going off at the same signal strength after every question that I asked because that's also very unusual. It's always very erratic. But I

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was getting up to three lights and then it would go back down for the same amount of time every time it answered.

Interesting.

Very weird. So I asked if it was malevolent, said yes.

I asked if it was feeding off of people's fear and it said yes. And I'm sitting here just like, "Oh my god." You know? And then I asked, "Were you created through human intervention? Was it through ritual? Was it through people creating you?" And it said yes.

Then I asked,

"Do you want to do harm to people?" And it said yes.

And it kept saying yes to all these things. And at that point, I was like, "Okay, I'm freaked out. I'm all by myself. this thing is saying it wants to harm people

and it's malevolent and it feeds off fear.

And then I asked, "Are you the one attaching to everybody?" And it said, "Yes." And I was like, "Okay, it's time to go now."

Do you think it's the creeper?

I don't know who it was cuz it didn't give me a name. I was kind of just

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asking whatever the malevolent entity is.

So, it gave me all these answers and I was like, "Okay, that's enough." And I picked everything up and and left. And I was like, I had this sense of impending doom that I never get. Like I'm pretty

pretty brave and I can do things that

don't freak me out. And in that moment I felt very scared. Like I felt like I was standing in the middle of the forest and I was prey. It was very weird.

So freaky. So I hightailed it out of there and I did all these things. I was like don't follow me home. Like I know you follow everyone home but you can't follow me home. These are my boundaries. None of that.

They even say, I mean, I think the creeper is a name that like humans have given the entity, but that the spirits themselves at Waverly Hills are afraid of that dark malevolent energy at Waverly Hills.

I could see that.

But then it will like crawl on the walls and ceilings and all the other spirits flee. Right. It's so strange cuz like in your questioning of this spirit, it

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seems like it was created from humans. And so like in my mind I was like, "Oh, I'm thinking of the bell witch and how you know like the theory is that woman, the neighbor, like the the bad pieces of her, the angry pieces of her like chipped off and manifested into this other entity that was evil, I guess, or meant harm." And so in a way I was like, "Oh, well maybe this is kind of nice if this thing can follow people and then like eat from them, like take from them some of the the things that are bothering them or like that

cause them anxiety." And that was like in my mind I was like, "Oh, this is going to be so special."

That's you wishful thinking.

Yeah, wishful thinking.

That's a nice way to look at it. I think it's creating fear. So it wants you It wants you to be scared. It wants you to have nightmares. It wants you to have that feeling of impending doom and

it wants to feed off of that.

It's not taking away your anxiety. It's giving it to you.

It's giving it to you because that's

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what's helping give it power.

And it had this sense of like desperateness to it where it felt like it was desperate for it.

If it didn't get that, I don't know if it would continue to exist.

It's just the feeling that I got.

Yeah. And in those questions, I was like, "Oh, this is very serious." Like, I don't know how it was created, but it's like life or death for this thing. It needs It absolutely needs the fear. It needs all of those horrible emotions that we're capable of feeling, and it'll do whatever it can to get that out of us.

It's also confusing, I feel like, when spirits because there's like trickster energy and and spirits who like maybe don't always tell the truth, but then this feels like a spirit who would benefit from lying and yet it doesn't. Well, because it doesn't even need to.

Yeah. Did you feel like it was following you the whole time you were there?

Yeah. Because when I went in there, I was like, "This is weird, and I really need to ask some questions." It was something that I had never faced. Um, I've dealt with malevolent entities

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before.

I'm like, "I see you. I get it." Like,

right?

Just leave me alone. It's fine. But this one in particular, the creeper, if that's what they're calling it, has this kind of primal feeling to it where it's very, very freaky. It makes you feel a way that I can't really describe unless you're there. It's almost like queasy and

heavy. So, it's fun having a conversation, but also so scary. And I hightailed it out of there.

Right. And like the potential it could have followed you. like you are opening yourself up to something that is not necessarily controllable like you don't have yeah you can set your boundaries and stuff but if it's that hungry and that malevolent like you don't know what it's going to do

I think that we are very powerful and I think even faced with entities like that that feel out of control or have kind of like elemental energy to them just strange bad stuff. I think we because this is our plane, this is our realm, we

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have the absolute power and staying strong and believing that and knowing that I think helps keep us protected even if we're going through things that it can feed off of. I know that

we're in control because this is our dimension. This is our realm. Even if there's some overlap happening,

it is scary as heck, but we do have the power over these things. It's just believing it. And the more we believe it, the stronger it'll be.

Yeah, it does make me think about like Sabrina and I talk about this because we we're newer to investigations and we've been to a few places now, but mostly with a couple of our friends and like a few other people that we've explored various places with, but

we feel like there's such an importance of who we pick to go investigate a place with just because of the intention and the energy that other people could bring in.

Yeah. And if we went to a place where someone is no boundaries, very much like, I'm going to [ __ ] around and find

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out, that's opening us up to to that energy, which we don't want.

Yeah.

We want to be respectful,

right? And we don't feel like powerful enough maybe in our own exploration of these haunted locations and like understanding different entities that we could encounter to just be able to be with anyone and still walk away being like, "Oh, we're fine."

Yeah. And that's not a beginner thing. For sure. If you're poking the bear, I would not recommend that to anybody who uh doesn't have a history in maybe knowing what they're doing when it comes to protection because you can stir up some stuff that you don't want

even in proximity to somebody else who's doing it, you know?

Right. Well, another thing that we've talked about a lot is I guess this is like a popular conversation to have right now because the Conjuring the last rights just came out, which is about the Smurl family. And something that is similar in the Smurl family case and a lot of poltergeist possession like cases is that the activity continues and

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continues and continues and no matter how many attempts to create a boundary or protect the space. It feels like those cases just kind of on their own after x amount of years the entity just like moves on. Because I do agree. I think our mind and our ability to create protection is very very powerful. But

what's your perspective on cases like that where it doesn't seem like there is rhyme or reason as to when it stops? It's not because

it's just like increasing torment and then silence and then all of a sudden poof gone. I think I'd have a better answer if I knew the exact details. But I do think that when we stop feeding into it, it slowly just kind of disappears. And I think there probably is a moment where somebody walks in and doesn't really feel much and they're like, "Oh, it's not haunted anymore." And that in itself creates that reality. I think that what we perceive is so powerful and what we're constantly creating as humans. I think we're

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actually projecting our reality all the time. And if there's more than one person walking into a space and saying this isn't haunted anymore, then it's not going to be haunted anymore.

Which speaks like the power of manifestation.

Totally. I totally like we're so powerful. We don't think we really even know

how powerful we are. Like I always believe people when they say, "Oh, I'm possessed or I need an exorcism." And those the people that have that background, I think because they believe it so deeply, it is real to them. And I do believe that

I believe in them when they say they need that. And I do believe that they need a priest and they need uh religious background style stuff for them to help them move past whatever it is that they're moving on from. So it's hard to tell. I think it really is us and what we bring into a space because I know that

Christian and Catholic based things I very much respect those faiths and or religions. It's just that they I know they carry a lot of fear when it comes

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to those things

and that's very very hard to combat because if you're constantly afraid, you kind of are inadvertently maybe manifesting that to happen because you're so afraid of it

and feeding it.

Yeah.

And feeding it. It's always good to have like a third party or another person come in. So I think like situations like the conjuring or the house and those situations where people are getting exorcisms because it has such a history in those face it's harder

to uh maybe remove that energy. Yeah.

Cuz they themselves are so scared of it that even if they wanted to get rid of it, they still are feeding it.

They're carrying that fear which is what it wants.

Yeah. It's always there in the back of your head. and a third party person maybe coming in and enough people being like, "Oh, it's not haunted anymore or enough time will eventually stop it from being haunted." Like, it'll just it'll just dissipate and become a house again.

But I also think there is some truth to different materials like wood

and different types of rocks and water

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holding energy and memory.

Yeah.

And being able to replay that energy or memory,

right,

when it's met with certain conditions. So, I don't know.

Damn. there. Yeah, there's I think that's the biggest thing is that we don't know,

right? And like even when we go when we've gone into places before, we're like, are we communicating with spirits who were already here and like this is who's here at this house or are these spirits who like we've just opened something up and they're passing through and we're conjuring them into this space

or like our guardians like people we carry with us all the time.

Yeah.

Yeah. So it is interesting to say a place is not haunted and then makes me want to almost like do a test in my own house like this place is not haunted.

Yeah. Do it.

Do I believe it?

Even as you say that you don't believe what you're trying to say.

Yeah. You have to convince yourself. And I think a good way to convince yourself is by saying it over and over and over again. Eventually you'll believe it.

Right. Damn. Finishing Waverly Hills.

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Would you go back and lay in the body chambers and talk to the creeper again?

For sure. I would do it again.

Oh my god.

Okay. Well, we want to go to Waverly Hills. So, we will call you up when we decide to go and

Yeah. We'll have another conversation because I got more questions now. I want to know details.

Right. It will probably remember you.

Yeah.

Oh, I hope it does. You should bring the um your doll, broken face porcelain doll with

She's so funny. I'll send you guys a picture of her. She's just,

you know, she still looks pretty, but her face is just it's been glued back together so many times.

Oh my gosh, I love that.

Okay, I want to know how you got into paranormal investigative equipment and like creating sort of these tools. And

pervy ghosts

can we hear your scary funny one first?

Oh. Oh, yeah. I forgot about that.

Oh, the scary funny one. Yeah, the this ghost was at this hotel and it

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wasn't who I was intentionally going in to speak to. I was going in to talk to the girl who was haunting the place who we did have a great conversation with. But after that settled down, I was sitting on the bed.

This hotel was built, I think, in the early 1900s. And I've got my socks on because I don't wear my shoes into bed, right? And I'm sitting there, got all my equipment everywhere. There's a chair. They call it affectionately the cuck chair in the corner. You know what I mean? It's just like

Yeah.

corner of the bed. I'm in the bed and I'm It's calmed down. I'm thinking it's the end of the investigation. Nothing that creepy happened. And there's a re pod at my the bottom of my feet at the end of the bed. And then there's a light bulb, those like motion activated light bulbs in the chair in the corner, the little cup chair.

And I take my shoes off, put my feet on the bed, and the thing lights up. And I'm like, "Oh, that's weird. I don't think anything of it, you know. I just continue on my investigation. Then I have the spirit box on and it starts talking about feet and I'm like, "No way

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this is happening to me right now."

A foot fetish ghost.

A foot fetish ghost.

Keeps talking about feet. So then I'm back on the bed, repot at the bottom. I'm going to lean into it. I want to see what happens. So I'm sitting there and I'm like, "Okay, what's your name?" And he says his name's Roger. I'm like, "Okay, Roger has a foot thing and he's hanging out with me." Okay, let's see.

Please tell me you like sultry take your socks off. And like

I I put my foot up and I was like, "Make the re pod go off and you'll get to see a toe." And I start like taking my sock off really slowly.

Oh my god.

And the cuck chair lights up. The re pod at the bottom of my feet starts lighting up. Everything in the room is lighting up over me taking my sock off slowly.

I'm obsessed.

Oh my god.

I was so freaked out cuz I was like, "Oh god, a creepy guy. Like that's just as scary to me as the malevolent entity at Waverly.

Right.

So I'm taking my sock off. Everything's lighting up. I'm screaming, laughing.

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I'm freaked out. I don't want to sleep there. This there's a foot guy.

Right. Right. He's going to tickle your toes or like lick them in the middle of the night.

He just kept talking about feet. And he wouldn't stop. Like every time the spirit box came on, he'd be like, "Nice socks." Says so many weird things. I'm just thinking about how many people have stayed in that room and unknowingly a ghost is just like getting off on their feet.

I know. Next time, pull up your Venmo and be like, "Can you work your ghostly magic?" And

yeah, send me send me 50 bucks.

Wow.

I do have a video of that though.

If you could just make that go off, I will show you my foot if you want to see the footsies. girl. That's a different color. Oh my god, that's going off over there. Do you have

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it?

Yes.

Oh my god.

Oh my god.

The way I'm covering up my foot now. I'm like,

"Oh my god." They're like, "Shit, girl. So weird.

Well, you can monetize that. It's behind a payw wall. It's you getting a ghost off for his foot fetish, but people can buy it to see your feet.

I can't believe that.

That is niche. And people would buy people would buy.

His face is red just thinking about it. Like he was so serious.

Sabrina's just like, "Yeah, monetize it. Sell it."

Yeah. We're full of business ideas happening. Like

make money off of it. Yeah, why not?

Well, you have to remember this is a scary experience. This isn't Yeah, but make money off of your fear.

Yeah, cuz I'm like, this guy better not follow me home. If I have to deal with a foot fetish ghost for the rest of my life.

Oh my god.

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Could you imagine calling somebody and being like, I need an exorcism. He's in defeat. Like,

and he won't leave me alone.

He can never take my socks off.

All of my socks are torn. Oh, that would be like the ultimate keep your feet under the covers at night

because I slept there that night. Yeah. Oh, you did.

And there was all this like there's like you can see me sleeping and you see this divot in the bed like down at the bottom where my feet are.

It was Do you think he was smelling them like leaning over?

God, I didn't even

Leave it to Karen to make it creepier.

Well, like he's sitting next to your feet. Of course he is.

I should have left him the sock as a souvenir.

You should have. But I also love that I feel like we tried to humanize the paranormal as much as possible. Like yes, there are different iterations and variations of the paranormal and different spirits, but this one was human at one time and carried over his obsession with feet. You know what? I actually respect this guy a bit because I feel like we are always like, "Oh,

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what are we going to do when we die? Like what do you do when you're a ghost and you get to have access to like whatever we have access to?" And this guy's like, "Here's what I liked in life, and it was hard for me to gain access, and I'm gonna figure out a way to just get a constant flow of what I like, which is feet."

So,

yeah, he Yeah, respect. He figured it out.

Yeah. I'm not going to yuck anyone's yum.

And he was forward with it, too. You know, like

So forward.

That's hilarious.

Perhaps he needs to work on his foreplay a little bit. But yeah, what do you get out of it?

He was having a field day, though, because it was me and my two friends. So, it's a bunch of cute girls in socks running around this place

investigating. He is like feet galore.

Yes.

Wow.

I love that.

Paranormal investigation. It can be so fun and also weird, right?

You never know what you're going to get.

I've had so many strange experiences. I had another ghost who wouldn't stop shouting anal every time I turn on the ghost box. And I was like, "Okay,

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I think that's hilarious. It's kind of like the penis game you would play with your friends.

That feels like a 14-year-old boy's spirit who's just like anal.

Yeah. Comes on.

I was like, "Can we stop, please? I'm trying to talk to something else." Like, this is too much.

That is hysterical.

Is your name Anal? Like, who are you?

He said it so clearly. I'll send you guys the clip. Are you a pervert? Yeah.

Do you have something to say? There's no way that was just said out of the ghost box.

You guys are being nasty.

Yeah, I really Oh my god.

I appreciate it. That ghost has a sense of humor cuz I think things that don't make it on Travel Channel, right?

They don't. Right.

Like we caught a ghost penis one time.

Yes. Famously. We were in a tabloid.

Our only piece of press.

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Yeah. But like I always joke that if I were a ghost, like I would be the spirit who's sending like menacing messages through a Ouija board or whatnot because it's fun. Like I would have fun scaring people.

I would too. I get inventive with it.

I think I want to be like a Dexter style ghost. I want to chase bad people and scare them to death.

I'm going to Seven Psychopaths.

I like a good idea.

Yeah, that will be my fetish in the afterlife. What would you do? Have you thought about it? Like if you were to cross over and you were able to do anything at all, like the the paranormal world was your oyster, how would you spend your How would you haunt? How would you haunt?

Oh boy. I think I would love freaking people out. I think I would be

Yeah.

So down with the white gown and the likeoo like like down the hall moving people's stuff around, stealing rings. I'd probably be like collecting things. I'd have like a little cupboard in the wall

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where I would keep all the stuff I stole from people.

Yeah.

Trinkets.

I like it. Your serial killer souvenirs.

Yeah.

Would you go back and haunt your younger self if you could?

Oh my gosh. I thought about this before. Yeah, totally.

Do you think you already are?

Yeah, cuz I thought about that as a kid. I was like, what if this is me in the

time is on top of itself

future? Because I've had all these weird dreams. Well, I had this dream about my dad. I think it was actually my dad.

He uh told me all these things about death and how time doesn't exist after you die. And he was telling me that it all exists at the same time, like it's on top of itself. And he was able to talk to me even though he had been reincarnated to somewhere in the early 1900s, which made no sense to me in that dream. I was like, I don't know what you're saying. But that's when he started saying,"Well, time doesn't really exist, and I'm living out these lessons that I was supposed to learn back when I needed to. So, I'm there's a

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part of him that could still visit me."

And at the same time, he's being reincarnated in the early 1900s. And at the same time, he's like in the 70s building like some bakery. He was showing me this bakery he was doing.

Stop. Oh my god, I have chills again. Like, it's so hard to comprehend.

So hard to comprehend. is how

and the crazy part about this dream is I had all of that I had this long conversation and that's the points that I remember the best and that's the best way I can try to articulate it because I still don't quite understand what he meant but he said that time doesn't exist stacks and he's saying that he can be in more than one place so even though he's reincarnated our loved ones can still be with us when we call and ask for them to be with us which is super interesting

right

so I was like well if you're somebody else how are you appearing as my dad to me now and he was explaining understanding that our soul isn't this one defined thing. Like

we can be in more than one place and there are lessons that we're learning.

We're everywhere. We're a part of everything. And it was super cool. So

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right before I woke up, he was like, "Oh, you're about to wake up now." He's like, "I need you to call your aunt and I need you to call your sister and tell her that I visited you and tell her everything that I said and that I love them." And I said, "Okay." Woke up, called my aunt, told her everything. Called my sister, told her everything, hung up, fell back asleep. And then I woke up to a phone call from my aunt at like 10:30. She's like, "How are you feeling?" And I was like, "I'm good. It's nice to hear from you." And she's like, "Do you remember anything from this morning?" I was like, "What do you mean?" I don't remember any of I don't remember calling them. I don't remember calling my sister and telling them anything. So she's she told me these things and it started coming back to me where I was like, "Oh my god, I remember that." So there might have been more that happened in the dream and I don't remember. But it was a very eerie experience.

Ooh. Oh, that is wild.

Which kind of brought peace?

Oh, yeah.

You know how we go into these haunted locations and we're always like, "Oh, something really devastating happened to this woman here and she's there and she's trapped." And I've always disliked

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the idea of that,

of something horrible happening to you or being a victim and being stuck in that forever,

right?

And what my dad told me gave me this sense that, oh, well, that's not all of them. That's just something that happened, a fragment possibly, right? and you're working through it. That part of you is still working through that trauma and that's why that still exists and why we're still able to interact with it, but it isn't them. So, they're not trapped there forever.

And that brought me so much peace in those situations with what I experienced my dad telling me.

It's like doing the shadow work and some time in the mess of time that will that haunting will no longer exist because that spirit has

worked through that. But it's also interesting because it like I used to have this coworker who was extremely intuitive. Like she was so intuitive that she like very consciously tried to like not touch people because she would just know way too much about them if she touched them. And she was just like she worked so hard at putting up boundaries to like be able to basically exist in

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the world. But she worked with a therapist and she basically did this sort of like shadow work in tandem with this therapist where she would go into the psychic paranormal plane, I guess, the astral plane and find these sort of fragments that belonged to someone's soul and help reunite it. And so whatever piece that they might not

I have so many goosebumps.

Yeah. It was like whatever piece they might not understand cuz like again like you're saying like it might not even be from that lifetime like they it might not have been something that actually traumatically happened to them in the current lifetime but like she brings that piece back to them so that they can heal it and be more like whole. I guess

this is blowing my mind. Like when we talk about like these things maybe one day not existing like that person who had that traumatic experience and died in a horrific way and like feeling trapped and then one day like that person just that spirit seems to like no longer exist. It could be something like that where like that piece is brought

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back to the whole

Well, it reminds me a lot of like EMDR work

like in therapy. And I I briefly have talked about this, but there's this one experience I went through that was really traumatic in high school.

And from ages 13 to probably 29, it was this memory that lived rentree in my mind. Like constantly I would revisit it. I would be traumat like retraumatized, re-triggered by it over and over. And then at 29 years old, I started doing really intensive like trauma treatment and therapy, EMDR being one of the practices. And I revisited that memory. And in a very similar to shadow work way, I brought myself back to that part of my soul, the traumatic memory, and I did all of this work to heal it. And I never revisit it anymore. And I think about it and I'm like, was that basement and like the place where this event happened to me haunted in

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some way? Every time my mind revisited it and felt that

trigger, did that part of my soul haunt

the basement where people live

and now it no longer does because I do I don't think

you can actively haunt a place while you're still living somewhere else.

Yeah. Yeah, that would make sense. I mean, from what I've experienced and how my dad was like, "Yeah, I'm here as me now and I'm still there." And from what you said, "Oh, it gives me goosebumps thinking about it." Because I mean, maybe there's some truth to that,

right?

And when people talk about helping ghosts move on, I was always like, I don't know if I like the whole go towards the light thing, but right,

I could see somebody walking in and just holding space or speaking to spirit and being like, why are you here? Are you okay? What can I help you with? Right?

Do you know that you don't have to be here anymore? You don't have to continue feeling this.

Just having that conversation and feeling seen is enough sometimes to help

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break that. And I've only experienced that twice with spirit where I felt like, oh, they they don't feel like they need to be here anymore in that emotion at least where they're not being dragged down.

That's really cool and really powerful to hear that other people have some kind of experience like that. And I've done EMDR too. And now that makes me wonder like how many fragments of me are existing out there, right,

that I've called back in and doing my own shadow work,

right?

And also in EMDR, you have what they call I can't remember what the specific term, but like you have your safe people that you can bring into memories when you're working through them. And I remember bringing my grandmother who was deceased even when I was doing EMDR. And it really felt like she was there. And now like even this is the first time I've thought about it this way, but was I calling her spirit to be there? Because it really did feel like she was there with me and holding me in a place where she had never been, you know,

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I was alone in that moment, but

I brought her into it and had like a spirit almost help my spirit.

Yeah, this is trippy talking about it, but it's also like very

I feel I feel healed again. Yeah, I think that's very possible.

But it's like there's so many layers and it's hard to understand. I think like kind of like Sabrina alluded to like when we first started the podcast, we had this one sort of narrow view on like people die and then there's ghosts and that was it. And now there's so many layers to every experience and like trying to understand what a spirit even is or different types of interactions and like yeah the time thing it like layering and even that it's like hard to comprehend because if it's like if time is

it's like everything all at once. Yeah. Like if it's all layered, it's like well then where does it where are there ends? Like where layered where

like it's all happening at the same time, but we're only perceiving a certain way that makes sense to us.

And like saying that your dad told you

1:02:00

he was reincarnated in like the 1900s, usually when we think of reincarnation, we think of, oh, your next life. But the fact that you could be

reincarnated in the past, but it's the present for them. Yeah. It's just But then there is no past and present. It's just everything all at once.

My brain

I know. I just It hurts to think about for too long. But

but it's so cool.

Yeah. It really changed the way I view the paranormal. It was a It was one of those things that changed how I investigate entirely.

Yeah. where way I even speak to spirit where I I feel like I know that this could be a fragment of someone who is very much living at one point and I don't want to come in and make fun of them or poke at them or be rude

just the same as I wouldn't want someone doing that to me and it feels like a calling of mine.

It's the same way you would treat humans like another person.

Yeah.

You know if you walk into a room and meet someone new for the first time you're not going to berate them and be

1:03:00

like show your muscles. I don't know, like punch me demon.

But that's kind of like what we were always saying like when we first started going into places, Sabrina and I, we were like, we're not going to go in and say like dance monkey dance. Like we're not there to force anyone to interact. It's more of just like

we're here if you want to talk.

Yeah. Yes. Do do you want someone to talk to? Like if so, we're here.

If you decide to talk and then you get too tired and your social battery is drained, we we get it. That happens to us constantly. Like you can change your mind halfway through. It doesn't matter.

Totally. But like it is interesting because it's like is it a fragment of someone who previously lived in this timeline that we're perceiving or

could it be someone who's still alive?

Yeah. So trippy.

Okay. Well, we could obviously talk about this because there's no answers

how Alex makes paranormal equipment

forever. But back to Karin's question about the paranormal equipment that you create and

what type of tools do you make and how did you get into that? Um, I think I've

1:04:00

I've always been a little bit into electronics. Like even as a kid, I used to fix my friends iPhones and jailbreak them for them. And I was really into doing those kinds of things on the computer. So, it kind of naturally happened because I wanted to know what was happening with these devices. I feel like most investigators should know exactly how their devices work so that they themselves can debunk in the moment or know if it's actually paranormal or not and you can have a better sense of what's happening.

So I started taking them apart and trying to figure out how they all work and it just snowballed into me making my own where I was like, "Oh, this is actually really simple. It's all very, very simple electronic stuff, very simple sensors that most anyone could do." And what I've built is just what's pretty much already out there. Like I've made my own spirit box. I've made my own um I think the only thing I've done different was I made this a talking board that illuminates when your hand goes over it. So it's

it's kind of like a proximity meter, but instead of you hearing the sound, you

1:05:00

see lights. So as your hand goes over signature kind of thing,

it just your skin entering a field. So like your body or energy entering the field will illuminate it. And there's a bunch of LEDs. I think there's I think there's about 50 LEDs underneath the board. And I have a bunch of holes drilled out so it looks like a constellation. And it says yes, no, maybe. And as your hand goes over it, it lights up and it kind of like fades and goes in and out. It's really pretty.

Oh, so pretty.

That's so cool.

But my hope is that, you know, a spirit will touch it and it'll illuminate and it has this soft glow and then it fades back down and it looks like

Has that happened at all? I haven't even brought it into an investigation yet and I really need to. So, thank you for reminding me,

Alex. I know.

Well, this just like goes to show how much I think you already have that you're like, "Oh, wait. I should probably bring that somewhere."

I don't know. Me and the spirit box, we are best friends. I love that thing. And I That's another thing about being respectful and sweet and approaching

1:06:00

investigations like you would another person. I think that they're very eager to talk to me. So I get really amazing ev evidence over the spirit box. I just have hours and hours and hours of responses that are pretty incredible. So I always forget about the other devices. I love using a spirit box, but I find that I am so I maybe I have bad hearing. I don't know. But I have a really hard time in the moment deciphering what they're communicating. Me too. But after the fact it's so much easier like if you're reviewing it or you know if you have a video of it. But I feel bad because in the moment I'm like, "Well, I'm not having a conversation." What you say?

Yeah.

Yeah.

How do you tune into it?

I think it's a lot of practice. I think the more you get used to hearing it, you can decipher the words. But I also use another device that's by Gary Gala. He sells this little, it's metal and it's a speaker that has a filter in it that filters out the radio sweeps. So all you

1:07:00

hear are the responses

and that helps be a little bit more tolerable. So you're not just hearing the you hear mainly just the responses.

Yeah, maybe that's what we called. Yeah. Do

he has like three different kinds on his site. If you Google Gary Gala, he's always doing stuff with it and showing people how it works. I think the ANC mini is the name of one of them. I think he's developed a spirit box that has it internally that you can buy, so it's built in. because I feel like that's one of the things that gets in the way because we've we've tried like the Estus method a few times and people are always like oh you know like you'll it'll eventually start sounding like a wave and you'll be able to pick out the words and we're like no it's just difficult the whole time it'll be like a half of a word and then I'm like was that actually something or was that just like part of the radio sweep like yeah it's difficult but again with practice

yeah you do start to hear it better the more you use it I have noticed that. All right. Well, I'm just going to turn it on every day.

Yeah, it really does work because I have

1:08:00

one really old spirit box I bought forever and ever and ever ago. And I have like four of them now,

the SB7, the original, and I use that one more than any other one cuz I hear everything out of that. I'm so adjusted to the way that one hears that that one sounds

that when I turn on the new one, I like can't make anything out. I don't know what's being said until later. So, it really is about just getting used to the sound of it and being able to pick out having your trusted

tools. Yeah.

Yeah. There might be something to us, you know, using it a bunch of times, too, and giving it power in that way.

Okay. Well, now I I'm like, when can we hang out?

I know. I was just thinking. I was like, do you have any investigations coming up? Like, what are your what are your next projects? What can we weasel?

Yeah. Like, I don't think I can be your haunted doll yet. I'm not dying yet, but how can we hang out in real life?

No. Please, can we? I'm so down to investigate. I'm always doing it.

Yeah, I would love to.

Alex's favorite investigation spot

Yes.

Is there a place that you have wanted to

1:09:00

investigate that you haven't yet?

What's top of your list?

I would love to go back to Waverly. I've been to almost every scary spot in the US. Oh my gosh, I'm drawing a blank cuz I have my favorites that I always go back to. So,

what are your favorites?

There's this place in Bisby called the Copper Queen that is one of the most haunted places I've ever been. And I love going because I always end up seeing a different spirit.

I'm texting that to myself so I can look up.

Well, I'm putting it on your computer. Let's see.

Oh my gosh. Come to Bisby. Let's go investigate the Copper Queen.

The Copper Queen.

Whoa. Oh, it's beautiful.

It is.

I've never even heard of this. Cool. Add it to the list.

There's a lot of ghosts. There's one malevolent one.

There's a guy that wears a top hat that walks around. We got the whole place to ourselves for an entire week when we investigated there. And God,

it was the staff and everyone's very nice, but they are very aware of how haunted this place is. And they let you

1:10:00

know. They're like, "Just don't mess with the ghosts unless you want to mess with the ghosts cuz they're serious here." And we had uh crew members that were getting scratched in the middle of the night.

Oh my gosh. Ken, my co-star, could not sleep at all because the entity in his room that claimed to be a little boy was not a little boy. Oh, yeah. I'm not quite sure what's going on there, but there's like six or seven entities that walk around that place that are very willing to

to hang out and talk and they're so active.

Great. I like places like that where you like know that no matter what, you're probably going to have some sort of interaction.

You absolutely are. Yeah,

I'm like so jazzed and hyped after this conversation with you. I'm like, "Okay, like we need to plan

and I Yeah, our investigation.

We will be in touch."

Okay, sounds good.

You're our friend now.

Following you to wherever you're going next.

Yes, please. I need more people to come with me.

Well, this is a good segue because I I'm curious if you have any other like

1:11:00

projects or big investigations or anything coming up. I'm just working on my YouTube and doing my normal investigations that I'm doing now. I have a couple cool ideas that I'm working on that are secret right now, but I'll be unveiling them soon. So,

there's

Well, in another timeline, we already know what the secret is.

I know. I guess we'll just have to wait.

And we're already investigating.

Oh my gosh. Well, let us know if you ever want us to participate and we will definitely do an investigation together. Okay, I will. Absolutely.

Where can people find you?

Yeah. What's your YouTube? Your social handle? What's your home address? I'm just kidding.

My phone number.

Yeah.

I You can find me on any platform under It's Alex Lame. It's included the it at the beginning. So, it's Alex Lame on YouTube, Instagram, Tik Tok, Substack, pretty much every platform. I'm on there under that name.

1:12:00

Amazing. Thank you so much for joining us. This was so fun. This is so great. And now I want more investigative equipment, too.

I know.

Oh my gosh. I'll make you guys something.

Wait, will you?

Yeah, I'd love to.

Oh my god. Oh my god.

Okay.

Okay. Wait. Amazing made.

Thank you.

Of course.

This is the best. I'm so excited.

This is the best.

I know.

Yeah. This is so fun.

My face has frozen into a smile this whole time. It hurts in a good way. Thank you so much for having me.

Thank you. Thank you for coming.

And we will see you on the other side.

Very spooky.