Unsolved Horror in the Soviet Mountains | Khamar-Daban Incident: 6 Hikers Vanished, 1 Survived (349)

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Blood around their mouths, bodies contorting. This is similar to the Dat Love Pass, but it's not that. This is Kamar Debon, and it's somehow even more disturbing.

Yeah.

Very spooky.

we haunted you again

Hello.

Three, two,

we just do that.

Did we? I think we did do it.

You know what we did do?

What?

We haunted people.

Oh, I feel so

I had a moment of panic where I thought you were going to say the last episode we recorded. Like that we didn't

Oh, no, no, no, no. That would be horrible. No, but what we did was we haunted our listeners like no other. And this is why when we say don't listen to an episode while driving, you

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actually don't listen.

Eric, one of our

listen to us.

Eric, who's on Patreon, got haunted by both episodes of the Hinsdale House.

Dang.

We had by the time we're recording this, only episode 344, part one has come out public. M we had seven at least seven emails come in to our inbox within a day of that episode being released. All people saying that they had car issues. Our own producer Emma who listens to the episode and creates social media listened in the car had weird car things happen in her family. It didn't even just affect her. It it affected the extended family.

So we are sorry but also

Yeah. And I feel like

we warned you.

Yeah. Sometimes we have no idea what's going to affect people, but this is one of the ones where we're like, we have a feeling that this one's going to be a bad one. So,

well, that one also because there were so many car accidents within the family.

Mhm. I know. Ooh. Do we have a warning for this one?

No. Maybe. Don't be an adventurer.

Don't go hiking. Don't go in the woods.

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Protect our national parks. [laughter] Yeah, let's bring that back.

Yeah. Where'd that go? H. Interesting.

intro Khamar-Daban incident

Okay. Well, we're not in the US for this one. Instead, we're going to be talking about six young hikers screaming, blood streaming from their noses and mouths. One bangs her head against a rock to make it stop. Another runs, eyes wide, foam collecting at the corners of his lips. And one by one, these hikers drop. And only one survives to tell the tale. But we have a survivor. We do. This is similar to the Diatlo pass, but it's not that. This is Kamar Don and it's somehow even more disturbing.

It's wild that it's even more disturbing and I've never heard of it before, whereas I feel like everyone has heard of

Datloav Datlov butcher a lot of things throughout our

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lives [laughter]

forever and eternity.

Yeah. Whatever

and beyond.

Yes. No, this one is like very bizarre. It's very brutal. There's unexplained tragedies that unfold here. It happens in the Siberian mountains. And it happened in the summer of 1993. It's a summer.

Uh-huh. And our birth year. Oh. And it's still an unsolved mystery even though there's a survivor. Whereas like the Diatlo pass, I feel like there was a lot of conversation around that because it seemed like there was this like paranormal element to it. Although now there's like newer theories that there was a a particular type of

avalanche.

Avalanche

and then hypothermia.

Yeah. Whereas this there's no theories like no like plausible theories or there theories.

There's some.

Okay. But you think it's still a mystery?

Yeah.

Okay. [laughter]

I think I do.

I think I think I do. Hm. Let me think. [clears throat]

the hike

August 1993.

Oh, literally August 1993. Okay. So, this is all about us now. This is about

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us. [laughter] The the witches were born.

Witches were born

in a cave in York, England. No. What episode was that? Last episode. One or two ago. We don't know. Okay. So, August 1993, the Soviet Union had dissolved just two years earlier. So, there was a lot of economic and social instability at the time still. And this was happening everywhere. But it didn't keep people from still having fun and adventuring and doing things that they wanted to do. And this is where we enter six hikers. They are from Kazakhstan and they were young, they were fit, and they decided to head into the wilderness with their trusted guide. And this is where the butchering of names begins, Leude Mila Corovina. Okay. And the group consisted of six students. There was Tatiana Filipenko, Alexander Christian, Dennis Schvatchkin, Valentina Utchenko, Victoria Salzova, and Timor Bapanov. Their leader, Lemma, was 41 years old,

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and she was this super experienced survivalist. She was known for her rigorous training, and she almost had this like militant leadership style. So, she if you're going to go into the woods with someone, if you're going to go mountaineering or like exploring, she was a very disciplined and trusted person. and she'd been hiking these mountains for years. And so she wasn't just like a regular guide bringing this group of students up. She was a master instructor in hiking and survival. And she was also

you know that she's like no BS. Like you're not going to mess around around her. She's going to like make sure you're following the rules,

right? Safety first. Like yeah, don't don't be a around her. And so she was this really highly respected person within the Soviet Tourism Federation. And her students were training under really harsh conditions. So she had them out in snow and rain and

the elements.

Yeah. Starved them. So they like experienced the hunger boot camp truly like how to survive anything. And that

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is basically what she thought that they were preparing for or prepared for,

which is crazy knowing that teaser you gave us,

right? That not everyone lived, only one person did. So this group sets out on August 2nd. They're planning a route through Kamar Deon Range. This is in southern Siberia and the group is planning to be right near Lake Ball. The trip is going to last about a week. So a week in the woods,

which is also wild.

Mhm. But at least it's like it's August.

Yeah.

It's summer in the mountains. I'm sure it's still like rough and cold and I'm sure there's still night snowcapped mountain tops in certain regions, but for this weekl long hike, they carried some light gear with them. So, they planned to forge some food. They expected to meet another group of hikers, also led by Leude Mila's own daughter on August 5th. So, it was like these two groups were doing their own thing. They're going to come together, have like this group. Woohoo! Pow-wow. But you know that they're putting so much planning into this so they know

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exactly how many miles they're going to hike each day so that they can reach the meeting point by August 5th.

Yes. And they're also like extreme survivalists. So it's not like they're worried about like oh no I didn't bring enough protein snacks or whatever. Like

they can forage for food. Like this has been they're not new. It's not like I'm me and I just signed up to hike Everest for the first time and I'm just trusting the sherpa to bring me. They have all been trained. Yeah. And they are with the master of this region, too. So, they're planning on meeting up on August 5th. The Kamar Dean Range is this super breathtaking mountain range, but it's also super remote and it's pretty treacherous. It's really sharp. There's jagged peaks, thick forests, cold streams that trickle down through like very slippery mossy rock. And in August, while you'd be like, "Okay, well, it must be warm and this is like probably the best time to go, this mountain range is known for having some pretty extreme storms and like thunderstorms in the mountains. It does sound like the world

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is ending if you've ever experienced that."

Yeah.

So, the first few days of the track go perfectly. It's uneventful. The group is making good time. They even reach the and this is another I don't know why I wrote so many words that I can't pronounce, but they reached the SL Slider Peak.

Okay.

Earlier than expected. So,

we'll add some pictures to make the pronunciations less [laughter]

less horrid.

Less horrid. Yeah. But anyway, so they're making good time. Everything's going to plan. They're in good spirits. They're taking photos. They're joking. They're setting up dinner. And then one day before they're supposed to meet the other group on August 4th, everything changes. Oh no. A storm rolls in. There's torrential rain, cold wind, and they're forced to set up camp on an exposed slope. So, this is really scary for most people.

Yeah. Even just thinking about this, like sleeping on a slope in this like jagged, cold, slippery mountain known

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for like unpredictable storms and I'm sure like mudslides and just flooding.

Did I tell you I fell fell out of bed the other day?

What?

I think you need bed rails. [laughter]

I might. I think I was just having a weird dream and I literally fell out of my bed. I And I woke [laughter] I woke up falling out of my bed. So I don't trust myself. I'm an unpredictable sleeper. I'm usually a stagnant don't move sleeper.

I think I just had

You and I have slept in beds together many times and we're both like you. We're both Yeah. We wake up in the same position we fall asleep in.

No, it was a very weird experience for me.

Oh, weird.

Yeah. Like I felt embarrassed by it. Like I think I would have felt less embarrassed if had I wet the bed. [laughter]

Okay. Okay. So, yeah, like if we were

Yeah.

in the situation, it was very scary for this group. I'm sure they were still scared, but they were like, "Okay, this is manageable for us with our skill set." Really harping on like what experts these people were,

right?

The morning of August 5th began like any

the incident

other. They had breakfast. They packed up their camp and they began descending the mountain. But not long into the

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hike, one of the group members, Alexander Christian, began to act strangely. He started screaming. This is the morning of August 5th.

Mhm.

So, the day they're supposed to meet the group.

Yes. There's they're hiking down to like go to their meeting point. He starts screaming. Blood starts pouring out of his nose and then his mouth and then he starts frothing at the mouth and convulsing.

Do they not eat like poison berries? It sounds like a poisonous food.

It does sound like that especially cuz it happened like right after breakfast.

Yeah. So Larard Mila, she rushes to his side, but she too then starts experiencing some strange symptoms. There's blood, there's seizures. Valentina described it as happening in a matter of minutes. So now we know Valentina is their survivor.

Well, so it's happening to everyone around the same time, meaning it does make me think it's something that they all seemed.

Yeah. Tatiana then collapses. Her body stiffens and her muscles start spasming and she starts to take her head and bash

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it into the rock over and over.

No, I just read a book called um one by one. I think it sounds so much I mean not the story itself but the way that they're

well it's like it basically like the way that it was described was Valentina was basically saying like it was as if her head hurt so bad she was trying to like basically end it by smashing her brain.

Yeah. Yeah. So the book one by one it's by Freda McFad and I just checked there's like someone who ate berries and they were poisonous

and granted that's fiction. This is not which so ah

so Victoria and Tamor they then began screaming and running but they didn't get far. They collapse in the forest blood around their mouths bodies contorting. So everyone's seizing contorting blood is coming from particular ores.

Horrible death.

Yes. And this happens for mere minutes. And within a few minutes, maybe like 10 minutes, six of the seven hikers were

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dead because there were six students

and the leader

and the leader.

So only Valentina remained.

So even the leader who had spent all this time like they were so like you really did harp on this like they have studied they have they no better person to take you into this mountain range.

Oh god that's so devastating.

Sometimes the most prepared people still.

Yeah. We're human.

Valentina was only 17 years old and she's now alone in this really treacherous

and she just witnessed all of her friends die this horrific violent death,

right? And now she's alone in the Siberian wilderness just out there with like bodies surrounding her [sighs] her friends, her mentors scattered around her, bloody frothing mouths contorted. It's like in the ring, you know, like when the people are like in

That's how I'm also just thinking about like one, your instinct is to survive on your own, but then it's also like I wouldn't want to leave my friends and loved ones like their bodies out here

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because in the wilderness animals are going to come get them and

Yeah, but then you also don't want to stay.

Well, I know. So, obviously survival

enter the grizzly bears of the Siberian wilderness. Like that's horrifying.

But then I just think about the wolves

because this is still a mystery and I don't know where it's going. But I'm thinking about these bodies never recovered so we can't get the full answer.

I'll let you continue. We'll get to that.

Well, poor Valentina. She's just standing there like amongst everyone and the silence is deafening. It's the

wind, the sharp air against her skin and just everyone she was just with for the past few days dead scattered around her. So, she's like, "I got to go. I have no idea what caused this and I need to get out of here. So, she took what she could. She grabbed what food they had, a tent, her personal gear, and she ran. She booked it out of there. But she didn't run for very long because her body was just so exhausted and her mind was just so broken from what she just

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experienced. So when she stopped, she pitched her tent near a small group of trees and she stayed there for the night waiting to be rescued and basically battling in her own mind like did I just hallucinate? Did I did I make all that up and I just ran away and like everyone's actually fine and something's wrong with me because you don't have anyone to talk to about this. So all so yeah, like your mind is going through so many different iterations of things

and it's like just imagine everything being perfect. you've trained for this and then just like in the span of a couple minutes

everyone dies.

You're completely the same and suddenly everyone around you is shrieking, blood like oozing out of all of their orififices like bones almost like seeming like they're cracking cuz they're seizing so hard.

It's awful.

I mean, crossing this in any way is I can't even imagine, but doing it alone in the wilderness,

right? So, there was another group that was supposed to meet them, right? And so she's she pitched a tent and she was kind of hoping like someone's going to come searching, someone's going to come

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find us, especially because if we don't meet up with this group, like they know that we're not

something's wrong. Something's wrong. Like someone's going to find me soon.

But no one came. What? So then she walked for 4 days through dense woods along icy rivers. She was battling starvation, trauma, hypothermia, and she followed the electrical poles knowing that they had to lead somewhere. So she's like eventually this electrical pole is going to like society

connect to a building or something.

So finally near theaya river she saw Ukrainian kayakers.

So she runs towards them barefoot shaking able to speak.

Yeah. 4 days later.

And I'm sure she was probably like kind of what you were saying with like the berries. She's also been trained in this sort of like survivalist mentality. So, I'm sure after watching all of that, that might have come to her mind. And so, I have no idea what she actually did to survive. I know she grabbed some

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food, but I wonder if she was like so hungry, too, cuz she was too terrified to forage anything.

Yeah, I would be.

So, these kayakers are like ultra concerned for her. Thank God. They're not like, "Oh, crazy person, run away from her." They grab her. They carry her to the nearest police station cuz she's so weak. She can barely like hold herself up. And the authorities have no clue what to make of this like outlandish story she's telling them about everyone frothing at the mouth dying in the mountains.

investigation

Yes.

It wasn't until August 24th, 19 days later that a proper search party is put together to go look for the bodies. Helicopters flew over the region and eventually located the corpses of

Oh, they did hikers.

Yep. Were they not paid apart by animals? Sorry, that's gruesome of me to say, but

I'm sure partially.

Okay. And what they saw was very gruesome. The bodies were partially undressed. Some were face down as if they had collapsed midun. Others had blood pulled around them. Leodma was

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found with signs of cardiac arrest. Her face was frozen in what witnesses later described as utter terror, which just does sound a lot like Deat Love Pass. Then it also kind of reminds me of that one ship where like everyone's faces were like frozen

in terror and it was like what happened?

You covered that one. That's that's such a

that was an an earlier year.

Yeah.

Podcast.

I think about that one a lot. That should revisit that.

You did such a good job actually. Okay.

Should do stories from the vault.

Yeah. Okay. So, now that the bodies are recovered, autopsies can be conducted. So, you would think, okay, we get the cause of death for everyone. Everyone had poison berries. Oh my gosh, that's what happened. But the official cause of death was hypothermia. What? For six of them? No, I don't buy it. For Nope, Leo Mila, it was a heart attack. I do not buy it. Not one bit.

What? So, yeah. Some of the details are not fitting exactly what happened, especially because there is one survivor who can tell you what happened. Okay,

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here's my conspiracy. Ready for it? Yeah. Okay. the government was growing some they were doing like a test on like vegetables that they were trying to use for like military purposes to like kill their enemies and it was in this region and they accidentally ate it and so the government can't say that it's from a poisonous food because they don't want to reveal that they're doing these tests.

Well, the good old government is definitely always included in some conspiracies or theories as to what happened. It also just sounds like no one's really believing

Valentina.

Yeah. Like no one's believing Valentina and so they aren't really taking her account of how they died seriously even though they have the bodies. I feel like they're like me case closed.

I know. And I'm sure like I don't know what her reaction was after. Like I'm sure she was in such a state of shock that maybe it was hard for her to get all of these details out in the beginning.

I don't know. But it does seem weird that it's like they say hypothermia.

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It's like

it just doesn't

Is that normal for a response to

hypother woke up fine including Valentina and then it was like an hour or like not long after eating breakfast

that they all start foaming from the mouths and bleeding out of

their minutes for everyone if it was hypothermia. You would think that it might over a few days based on people's different like body and weight and

and then Valentina would have had some evidence of that.

Yeah. And she had absolutely nothing.

Nothing.

I mean by the end she was hypothermic. was that she was alone for 4 days

and she didn't foam out of the mouth and bleed and

no.

Yeah. Okay.

Okay. So, yeah, hypothermia and then for lea a heart attack. So, clearly there

which happened at the exact time that everyone else died from hypothermia.

Details are not fitting the crime here. Whatever this crime is. So, several of the hikers had signs of pulmonary edema, so fluid in the lungs. Others had bruises consistent with internal bleeding. All of them were protein deficient, malnourished despite only having been gone a few days. So it does kind of seem like cultish in a way where

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it's like were they being cuz Ludma did kind of like encourage them to starve themselves sometimes to like survive the elements and like understand how to [gasps]

Oh my thunder. That was amazing.

That was so scary.

Holy

Did you guys hear that? I hope

the loudest crack of thunder. There was no thunder before.

There's been zero thunder all day. It's been pouring. That I love that so much. [sighs]

The gods are playing bowling. [laughter] Okay. So, yeah, they had

Why did I say playing bowling?

Playing bowling.

They're just bowling or

So, they had a lot of signs of like malnourishment despite only having been out in the wilderness for like a week long trip and not even making a week.

Okay. Otherwise, there were no signs of trauma, no bites, no infections, and basically no answers because what the

autopsies were like declaring as the death didn't make sense with the events

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that occurred,

right? Well, because even with Datlav's past, like they did die of hypothermia and a lot of the ways that their bodies were found, like yes, there was a distortion like the one person had bit their tongue off.

Yeah.

Things like that.

Another person was like fully naked,

right? because

hypothermia makes you think that you're hot

think you're hot. Yeah. So there's like similarities in terms of the presentation of how the bodies maybe were found.

But that's the only connection I can

Yeah.

find. Yeah. I don't know. I What I do know is Valentina was in the hospital for a long time and she was suffering from some pretty intense PTSD from witnessing all of this

and she very rarely spoke of the incident. So, I'm not sure how much information she was able to contribute to the actual

investigation.

Investigation.

Yeah.

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theories - hypothermia & poisoning

But now we're entering theory land.

Like theory land.

Theory land.

It's like fairyland. Like theory land. [laughter]

And this is where things get a little murky because of course theories are theories and a lot of theories are from Reddit and like people just you know theories are gossip also. And according to the government, it's a case closed, right? They died of

So you can only go off of so much information.

Yeah. They didn't look into any other other causes.

Yeah. There's a lot of speculation in a bunch of different communities. So hypothermia was the official cause of death. And yes, hypothermia can cause irrational behavior. Like you were talking about paradoxial undressing when you I literally wrote like what I was referencing before. Like if you've ever read the book Into Thin Air by John Crackour, he writes about this about like when you have it's the the book about like climbing Mount Everest and it's based on a real story. But yeah, like when people experience extreme hypothermia, their bodies trick them

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into thinking that they're overheating and so they start taking off their protective gear

and basically end up succumbing to the elements even quicker than they already were. If you're at that point, you're probably already dead

or going to die, unfortunately. Mass seizures and bleeding from the nose and mouth is a little bit more questionable when it comes to hypothermia. One theory was toxic mushroom poisoning. Coravina was known to forage and certain mushrooms do cause hallucinations and seizures and death. But again, it would also be strange for one person to be completely unaffected and all the others to be killed unless Valentina didn't eat the mushrooms,

right? That would be like the one time where like I don't like mushrooms saves your life,

right? Or I'm full.

I already have my two berries.

Yeah.

Some believed that maybe the water could have been contaminated. Lake Ball wasn't far away. And in Soviet times, there were rumors of illegal industrial dumping during the economic collapse following the fall of the USSR.

So not mystery,

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but still like government doing something that they weren't supposed to. Again, there rumors that there's illegal activity. But basically, the question was like, is there runoff from this old weapons lab maybe too that could have been contaminating the water source or is it simply industrial waste that it's polluted with

and maybe they drank tainted water and then maybe Valentina drank the same water but for some reason was fine or had so little of it or didn't have any water at all from one source because she already had

like a canteen of some other water, right? And so these were the questions.

But again, it's like without all of the information being offered up by Valentina and the actual investigation happening, there's just a lot of theories and talk within the communities about what could have happened,

right?

But Valentina was 17 when this happened.

She was 17.

She's so young.

And she was hospitalized for a long time because she just was so

of course

I mean physically injured from being out there, but also mentally

Yeah. really struggling.

theories - supernatural

But maybe it wasn't human interference.

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Maybe the mountains hold some secrets. Well, we know the mountains hold some secrets. The Borat people, an indigenous native group of people in this region, have beliefs that are kind of like a mix of shamanism and Buddhism.

And they believe the mountains are alive and not metaphorically, but like literally alive. And that there are spiritual entities living here, guardians of balance and harmony between the natural world and the unseen world. I mean, we believe that too.

Yes, totally. And actually so in this culture they believed that not all spirits are so benevolent and rumors started circulating about beasts and spirits in the mountains. Some of them murderous and looking for their next victim.

Some shared stories about how they knew someone who knew someone whose brother went missing whose eyes had bled when they entered the mountain. And just like all these rumors were going and going and going. And this was also like the indigenous culture was like oh yeah don't go into those mountains. this is not a place to go. Like this is a dangerous space. And so now it's just

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like adding to the lore especially mystique.

If one person's like, "Oh yeah, there was a story of so and so who went in there and their eyes started bleeding and then this story happens,

right?"

That spreads.

Yes. People started talking about encountering orbs and other strange anomalies. A lot of people said they had really bad feelings when entering the Kamar Devon mountain range. And so people are sharing their suspicions, these anecdotes, their experiences. And many start to feel that it all comes down to something strange and odd happening in the mountains, not necessarily something that this group of hikers did or accidentally did, but it's the mountains fault. Something here killed them.

Okay. So, which is interesting because I feel like often when you talk about like the power of nature, it's usually and I feel like I'm referencing what we've talked about with Appalachia, but like

it's usually don't wrong the land or these beings will punish you.

Yeah. And I feel like that belief kind

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of also comes into this mountain range even more so where it's like the mountain remembers and it will know what happened and like replay what happened because people have also been talking about like

screams coming from the mountain and like whatever happened basically like being replayed up here

which is so sad.

Yeah.

Scary if you're hiking out there and you hear that,

right? People say it often happens at night which is really scary cuz like of course this happened to these people during the day and so it's like is this a replaying of what happened or is there something else in the mountain

or an animal that screams?

Yeah. People say like especially when they're alone at night it'll [clears throat] happen.

Great. So people have wondered could the Kamar Dean tragedy be more than a physical event? Could it be spiritual? Some sort of like reckoning or an ancient force deciding who lives and who dies up here? We don't really know. But it all comes down to treat the mountain with respect. And if the indigenous people say don't go into the mountain, definitely be very careful about going into the mountain or don't go.

theories - gov't testing

And now we dawn our tin foil hats.

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Conspiracies

and we tell you about government coverups and Russian secrets.

Love it.

The Kamar Debon range is not just beautiful, it's also strategic. It's remote. It's wild. And during the Soviet era, it was dotted with closed cities, hidden research sites, and places where maps simply stopped being accurate. It's

like Area 51.

After the fall of the Soviet Union, a number of classified defense programs were exposed to the public. One of them was cenamed Kimashida, which means chemical defense. And this

and that's actually known to be true. Like this part is the real thing or

I think I don't know. I was kind of this is where I was in Google and it was

and you were like I'm just going to go with a little bit. Okay.

I feel like sometimes when we research stuff that happens in other countries and it's like a part of like a deep lore within another country, it is really difficult to decipher and I feel like sometimes there's a lot of websites that just are maybe about it but in another language and it doesn't quite translate

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right

well. Or I feel like we are often served like in searching it the Americanized retelling

and it is harder to find authentic sources from those places.

Yeah. Like I just tried googling it again and everything's coming up about just like Putin and Trump. So

yeah. Well, I also just do believe the governments are constantly operating and running places that we don't know about. But it's also hard too because it's like we're in America and there's a lot of like Russia versus US and there's a lot of like propaganda and stuff and so it's like

existed for a long time.

Who knows if this actually did occur or if this was something fed to us or fed to people in the US.

Yeah.

Either way, conspiracies in the conspiracies. So take this all with a grain of salt. So basically was saying that there are declassified documents and firsthand whistleblower reports suggesting that the Soviet military was testing chemical dispersal methods in these mountains because it was

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uninhabited and basically like you know we've heard it a bunch with like even like US military testing where it's like testing out nerve agents and just like what fumes can you put in the air to just like kill or paralyze an entire group of people

by the Or

this would work with my theory of like were they planting something? But like

if they dropped some type of chemical

that it could have just on a off chance the one piece that Valentina had wasn't tainted by that chemical,

right?

Yeah.

Apparently the tests were not always accounted for. There wasn't really good uh reporting done.

Mhm. And there was basically like an offlimits area of hundreds of miles across the mountain range, not because of the terrain, but because of possible contamination. And so people are wondering like, is this what happened here? Did they wander in this area unknowing

that this was part of like some sort of secret government testing site that people would like later find out because again, there were like whistleblowers,

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which again with like the whistleblower, was that true? Was that someone else? Whatever. Some fringe theories suggest that there was electromagnetic anomalies causing mass hysteria and neurological effects. So basically

which was very much the love of past.

Yes. And like was there a big sound wave that came through and caused this panic and there's frequencies and it's scrambling some people's brains but suddenly somehow Valentina doesn't get affected. That's the weird thing, right? Another one of the theories like goes back to the nerve agents which are like have been used in the past. Like this isn't really a conspiracy in terms of like what it is. It very much exists, but the conspiracy is were they testing it in the mountains.

Sure.

So, it's used in assassinations, but it does cause seizures, foaming at the mouth, and death.

And so, again, people are like, did they stumble into this test zone and maybe they inhaled something?

But then, why was it only why how did Valentina survive? That is the question. If it is one of these, whether it's food or a chemical agent of some kind, I

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think you would have to then buy into the fact that Valentina by miracle survived or chose not to eat that thing,

right? Well, and so that's when kind of some of the supernatural theories come back into place because people are like, "Well, did they disturb something in the mountains,

something so ancient, and maybe Valentino was the only one to not participate in a certain thing or step on a certain thing that was so sacred that basically resulted in them being killed."

I have such a like my instinct. I have a mama bear instinct to protect the nature and the nature spirits because

like why would what was their why what motive do they have?

Is this a group of people that are like the leave no trace type of people the wilderness? Yeah. They have so much respect for it.

Dyatlov Pass

So quick background into a similar incident which we've been referring to a bunch left past. We covered it in episode 116 unsolved mysteries. It was

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1959. Nine hikers, all found dead. One with a crushed skull. Another had bit her tongue out and it was like missing from her mouth.

What did you cover in that episode? Was it the ship?

Oh, was it? I'm trying to think.

It's the Orang Madan ship. Two girls, one ghost. We're going to Google this. Like, we can't find anything that we've covered before

cuz we did not properly label it in our episode notes.

I have no idea. We'll find it when we covered the [laughter] but that was the ship and I remember covering it. Okay. But in the diatla past there were nine hikers found dead, one crushed skull, one missing a tongue, radiation on some of their clothes, no footprints, no explanation. Sounds very familiar to what happened here. And the parallels of these two cases people's there like it's just so wild because it's a remote mountain range. Very experienced hikers like they were researchers in the Datv Pass,

right? and then very sudden violent

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deaths and no clear cause although now there's some theories.

Um so recent investigations into the 1959 DF pass incident suggest that there was a slab avalanche triggered by specific environmental conditions which may have caused the hiker's mysterious deaths. So basically like I watched like a video of it happening where it's like there's pressure where it like the snow pushes down and then there's almost like a sheet

of like like a super like quick and violent almost like a missile of like icy snow that just like thrusts out and basically killed them. In 2021, there was a study that demonstrated a combination of factors such as a cut in the snow slope that the tent was set up on and an accumulation of wind blown snow and the presence of catabatic winds. So basically all these things that like you're like what? How do you even figure this out? Yeah. Which

and again how does one person survive that?

Yeah. So that's for the DF pass. Oh, however the DF pass also had one

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survivor, Yuri Uden. He left the group early due to an illness.

Oh. Oh, but that's different. That That feels

He wasn't there for it. Thank God.

Yeah. Yeah. I found it. It's episode 23. That's when we covered it.

Very early.

It was ghost ships.

Ghost ships.

spirits on the mountains

Okay. So, here's where things take a little bit of a wild turn cuz like obviously there wasn't an avalanche happening at Kamar Dabon. So, kind of going back to like the paranormal side of things, people have pointed out that Kamar Debon is not the only place in Siberia with stories like this. There have been many weird weird things and people feeling things in the mountains.

So, in 2014, there were hikers in Al Thai Mountains reporting the feeling of being watched, a pressure on their chest. And this one guy said that he felt such a big pressure that he actually collapsed. And when he looked to his GPS to like figure out where he was going, he was completely fried. So again, it's like kind of back to like government testing or like electromagnetic anomaly

or even just paranormal. Like paranormal

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messes with electricity all the time and people's like phones stop working and GPS whatever glitches.

So then in 2001, there was a group near Lake by Call, so right near where these hikers, most of them died. And they saw orbs of light moving silently over the trees. [gasps] and two of the campers were said to and like again let me repeat that these are like stories from Reddit. [laughter]

Yeah, but this is also a paranormal podcast and also like people share their weird experiences on Reddit all the time the way that they email them to us.

Yeah. Two campers went missing for 6 hours and then returned barefoot unable to explain where they had been.

Aliens. All to say the mountain holds

the mystery remains

many secrets. And what happened in the Kamar Debon tragedy incident is still a mystery. And so what does everyone think? Was it poison? Was it panic? Was it a hidden military operation? Or maybe something supernatural? The truth is we

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probably will not know. I'm not sure that I fully believe the theory behind the Diablo pass either. [laughter]

I buy that way more than I buy that these people had hypothermia.

Right. a hypothermia and a heart attack all within like a couple minutes of each other.

No, I don't buy that for one second.

The Kamar Debon incident remains one of the most baffling mysteries. There's horror, there's blood, and there's one lone survivor, which makes you wonder what is hiding in these mountains. And will you ever be safe?

Well, the answer is no. You're never going to be safe anywhere. Sorry to end with that, but I really don't think it was supernatural, especially even those other stories that you shared, which maybe it is aliens. None of them are dying, bleeding out of their orififices.

Whereas this, and I'm no expert and I didn't get my own hands on the autopsy of the bodies, but

I really really think it was something they consumed.

Yeah, it honestly it does sound like that.

Whether it was like a poisonous berry or

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a toxin on a item that they ate.

I just wish we had more information from Valentina. I know obviously like we don't want her to relive that trauma over and over again, but I feel like that is kind of like the knowing what her day was like in comparison to the others. I think would

help help, right? Cuz either we have somebody freaking autopsy cuz you could look at the food that is in their stomach.

I know

not anymore now, but like you could have done that examination and see the contents.

It's definitely not hypothermia. We know that.

It's definitely not. But it does make me so curious about like the whole nerve agent thing because also it's like was everyone outside at breakfast and she was inside the tent getting dressed or something and there was some sort of like

she shifted and like took this like noxious agent

to the group of people around like their fire or like whatever and she missed it by like 60 seconds or something. Then they all go about having their breakfast for 20 minutes and then it just hits everyone and that's why she couldn't identify what happened because maybe

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there was an amount of time. Anyway, I also don't think I don't I don't think it's really that supernatural. I am kind of with you where like there's some other third party element involved. Oh, here's another mystery. What happened to Ludma's daughter and that other group that was

Why didn't the other group find them or like alert that there was something wrong? Why did it take 19 days to send out a proper search? Although I will say like it very much could have been a weather related thing cuz the mountain there's some bad storms. They might have just not found a window to go that deep. [snorts]

Well, it's very sad and I I do feel really bad for Valentina.

listener story

While that one may not be the most supernatural, this story from our listener might be. H.

Okay, this is from Anonymous and it's called Unexplainable Events in Yellowstone National Park. Hello Karin and Sabrina. I wouldn't say I'm brand new to your channel. I've played your videos here and there when I'm in the mood, but recently I've been keeping up with you guys regularly and I would now

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declare myself a very active fan of Two Girls One Ghost.

Thank you. If you do read this, please keep me anonymous. Okay, here's my experience. So, quick background. My sister, my family, and I have all had strange, unexplainable experiences throughout our lives, things we couldn't explain. I've even messed around with a Ouija board before. And while some people say that can make you more susceptible to the paranormal, I don't know if that's true or not. Either way, my entire family has always believed in the supernatural. And since we were kids, we were obsessed with ghost reality shows, horror movies, basically anything spooky. My family used to watch them almost every other night. So, weird experiences never really felt out of question, but I decided to tell this particular story because I think it's my favorite. And I can tell you guys like ones about camping and hiking.

Oh, yeah. Because we fear it. This story takes place while my sister and I were working in Yellowstone National Park for the summer. Some of our co-workers had planned a 13-mi hike, but unfortunately, my sister, who also happened to be my

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dorm mate, and I had shifts that day and could not go. If there's one thing everyone knows about hiking, it's that you always tell someone where you're going.

You tell them when you'll be back, and you never hike alone. My sister's close friend told her the group should be done by 9:00 p.m., 10 p.m. at the absolute latest. He also told her exactly which trail they were hiking. There were at least eight people going, so we didn't really have any concerns about wild animals, and all of the people in this group were experienced hikers. There was truly no reason to be worried. That's how every story starts.

I know. I feel like everyone needs to be like slightly paranoid at all times and then maybe fewer things would happen.

They were so worried going into this hike, but they made it back. Okay. Okay. So, that evening, I got off work around 8:00 p.m. I went back to the dorms. I showered, and then I hung out in the common room playing pool with my sister, my dormate, and a few other co-workers who also did not go on the hike. Time slipped away, and when we finally looked down at our phones, it was 10:30 p.m. We

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all realized the hikers should have been back by now, or at least sent a text. It was late and dark. But honestly, it wasn't that weird for employees to do night hikes, sometimes with flashlights. Sometimes, honestly, just by moonlight. To be honest, it would have been more weird if you were an employee and had never done a night hike.

Fair. Still, knowing this, we were worried about their tardiness. We all tried calling them, but every single call went straight to voicemail. We knew that there was no service on that trail, but still it was worth a shot. We all had this nagging feeling that something was wrong. But even with that, we couldn't reach them, so we just kept playing cool. Maybe they were a little bit more delayed.

Oh my god.

We told ourselves they were probably just a little slower than expected. I mean it's

this is what LWD Mila's daughter you would think would be thinking with her own group.

But like okay they said by 10 p.m. the latest it's 10:30.

You're like give them an hour wiggle room.

Yeah. Even like 90 minutes I would be like okay well couple pea breaks someone

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slowed down.

But as time ticked on we were getting more and more nervous and we started asking if we should do something. By midnight with still no word our nerves won. Our other co-workers had gone to bed, but my sister, my doormate, and I decided to drive out to the trail head to check. I don't even know what we thought we would do once we got there because none of us were exactly equipped to go searching. We were literally in our pajamas and Uggs, but we figured we had to try something. The drive out there was maybe 15 minutes. Yellowstone at night is dark. Not like suburbs dark or country road dark. I mean pitch black wilderness dark. No street lights, just two thin cones of headlights slicing through endless trees. We turned onto a narrow side road and into the trail parking lot. Lodgepole pines towered around us, so dense that they felt like they were invading our personal space. For reference, once my sister and I parked here in this very same lot, thinking it was secluded, only to realize another car was only 15 yard away. But we couldn't see it until we

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were leaving. That's how dark it is.

Oh. This time, we drove slowly around the entire lot, checking carefully. Our friend's cars were there, but they were not. My sister grabbed my door's bear spray, insisting she was the most responsible to carry it. We all had flashlights, though beams looked pathetically small against the wall of trees. We stood at the trail head, pointing our flashlights into the dense forest. The dirt trail stretched only a few feet before it was swallowed by the dark. The silence was loud. There was no wind, no bugs, no distant animal sounds, just nothing. The only noise we heard was our feet on the gravel and our small talk.

Yeah. So, there's a predator around you. Spiritual, paranormal.

Yeah.

Or real life animal.

Also, knowing that their friends cars are there and they're not is even more of an indication something's wrong.

Something happened.

So, we hesitated, not knowing what else to do. My doormate suggested yelling their name. So, we all started calling them out one by one, the names of all

46:00

the hikers. She even shouted her close friend's name over and over, yelling things like, "Hello, can you hear us?" much louder than I just said it. Her voice echoed back through the trees, but there was no answer, just silence. And the longer it went on, the heavier the air felt like it was pressing down on us. After no response, we whispered to one another and decided to walk in just a little bit further, far enough to peek around a curve in the trail. A footstep sounded unnervingly loud on the dirt. We stopped, too scared to keep going, and we called her friend's name one more time. That's when it happened. From deep in the woods came a noise. At first, it sounded animallike, but not. It was like a bird's caw mixed with strange chirps, then insectlike clicks, but none of it was right. I have been visiting Yellowstone since I was a kid, and I have seen multiple things that people would consider a once- ina-lifetime event, like a bear defending its food from a pack of

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wolves, a wolf pack hunting an elk, three adult bears fighting over a carcass. My family and I have always been the adventurous type, hiking, camping, where we were always in the woods. But still, I have never heard anything remotely like this. It was too loud, too off, and the sound lasted only a few seconds. And then it went completely still again. We froze. All three of us had heard it. And then a second sound cut through the silence. It was a laugh. I'm so disturbed by this. A human laugh, except it wasn't human. This was 10 times louder than any person could possibly laugh. And it sounded almost identical to a real laugh, but twisted, exaggerated, wrong, like something trying to imitate a human laugh, but not quite getting it right. The second it hit my ears, my whole body went cold. I didn't think I just whispered, "Run!"

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We started jogging back to the car, trying not to sprint in case it was an animal, because first rule in an animal encounter is to remain still. But every fiber of sense left our bodies as soon as we heard that noise. My sister headed for the driver's side door, my doormate for the passenger side, and I went for the back. But my doormate was running far too slow, and panic shot through me as I imagined all the possible things that noise could have been. I yelled for her to hurry the up, which freaked my sister out because she was all the way in front and had no idea was happening behind us. Thought that meant something was chasing us. So, she screamed. She bolted full speed. That set all of us off, sprinting the last few yards, gravel flying under our shoes. We dove into the car, slammed the door shut, and peeled out of the lot. The drive back to the dorms was tense. My sister was gripping the wheel, going way too fast down the dark, curving roads. And we started to think of what to do since our friends were still on the trail, and we were too scared to go back by ourselves, just three teenage girls. We decided we needed to text the people we were playing pool with earlier

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to see if any of them were still up. We all had our phones out. We were obsessively refreshing, waiting and praying for just one bar of service. Whoever got it first would text. Finally, I got a single bar. Instantly, we texted the group, hoping someone would respond. One of them did, and we quickly called him to tell him to be ready when we pulled up to the dorms because we weren't going to waste a second. My sister floored it. While driving back, we kind of kept quiet around the subject. None of us wanted to say out loud what we were really thinking because the only explanation that made sense in my brain terrified the living out of me. We made it back in less than 15 minutes. We picked up this guy outside of his dorms and we tried to explain, but all of the words sounded ridiculous as they were leaving our mouths. We couldn't even bring ourselves to describe the laugh. Also, it's like, what the could it be? Like, it doesn't even seem like it could be human. And then as we were about to turn back to the main road, we saw our friends cars pulling in. We whipped our car back and followed them back to the dorms. When we were back there, we

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demanded answers. Their only explanation was that their hike simply took longer than expected. They reached the turnaround point at sunset, hung out for a while, then hiked the 6 and a half miles back in the dark. That was it. Also, like, why do we need to do the hike in the dark?

It was nearly 1:00 a.m. by then, but they weren't planning to. But they were like, "We have to get back."

Yeah. Kind of. They planned on it being night time because it was the night hike. Everyone does the night hike.

No, no, no, no. That's That's different. They were saying that everyone has hiked at night. This wasn't a night hike. They started during the day. It just took a lot longer than they expected, which is weird because they're experienced hikers.

Also, like that's not longer. That's 4 hours longer,

right? That's significantly longer. So, it's nearly 1:00 a.m. by then. Everyone went to bed, but my sister slipped into our dorm room through the connecting bathroom. And normally, we would chat about random things before sleeping. But this time, we just kept circling back to what happened. Finally, I said what I had been thinking out loud. Whatever had made that noise certainly was not human.

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We called out into the woods like every folktale tells you not to do, and something responded. This trail and most of Yellowstone land is old Native American land, but this particular trail was to a river that many tribes used as a water source. My sister immediately agreed with me. She had hiked that trail many times before and she'd never heard anything like those sounds. So, she even has hiked it. Meaning that like people who went on that hike have done that hike before, meaning that they should have known the amount of time,

right?

So, something was with them, warping their time,

luring everyone in. I'm just like, keep out of the wildlife in this area, too. I'd be terrified of wolves specifically.

Yeah.

Being hunted by the wolves.

It's just also the way that this listener described the silence.

Mhm.

Which usually there's bugs, there's wind, there's animal sounds, there was nothing, and then there was this unearly inhuman sound.

Anyway, that night we all went to sleep, still replaying what had happened, trying to find an explanation, but

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coming up short every time.

Flush pedestrian.

And here's the thing. To this day, I've tried to describe what we heard, but I can't. It was unlike anything I've ever heard in my life. Completely alien, indescribable, and it still chills me now to think about it. Most recently, I've become more confused by the fact that the group of hikers returned to the dorm less than 10 minutes after us. If they were that close from the trail head, there should have been no reason for them to not hear us. If they were that close, they would have heard us. Especially if it's so still, so quiet, you would think the sound of them would carry. But when we had asked them if they heard us calling to them, they told us they didn't hear a thing. I'd love to hear your opinion on this story. If you ever do use it, thanks. Thank you.

I hope these events are scary enough for a video. They are. Peace and love from Anonymous.

Um, Anonymous, I kind of think you encountered some sort of flesh pedestrian

like laugh kind of sounding human but also not. feels very on brand with a flash pedestrian who's like trying to

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mimic and be human but like not well enough,

right? But it's also preventing the sound of this listener and her sister and doormate from

like their sound of calling to the others

from reaching them.

So, it's almost like barrier that it's putting between them,

which I'm glad it was that and not the voice mimicking one of the friends,

right? because that would have been terrifying.

Be lured off the path to go find the friend. It's just weird that like the other group just was like, "Oh, it simply took us longer." Like 4 hours longer for a 13mi hike.

That is a lot longer. That makes no sense. Like why didn't they clock that?

Well, that makes me mad at them a little bit too because I know there's

no people are waiting for you.

And I know there's not a ton of service, but there had to be one moment where there was service where they're like, "We should send a message and make sure that they don't worry about us,"

right? or like hustle like sorry it's it's already night time you shouldn't be there like book it get out of there

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that's so scary and given that our listener who sent the email worked at the national park

and spent years and years and years exploring the nature hiking camping all that and this is the only time they've ever had an experience like that

it's actually kind of a miracle that that's the only time that they've experienced [laughter] that

or to that extent

yeah yeah

terrifying I mean they had to have been so so scared to just show up in their pajamas, right? It's like you're you're on like a recovery

Yeah.

mission. Cuz if you wait and you're like, "Oh, it's fine." Every second counts, right? So it's if you keep convincing yourself that they're going to be okay.

Yeah.

If you had reacted when you first thought you should, they might have been, but because you waited so long, they might not. So I understand being like, "No, we just need to get in the car."

And they're hoping that it's not a big thing that they'll be there in a minute, you know?

Yeah. or they'll find them at the trail head.

But nothing, just an evil, inhuman laugh. At least everyone survived this one.

That's true. Um, if you survived a

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strange encounter in the woods, please email us. If you've had any paranormal encounter, please email us two girls one ghost podcast@gmail.com. You can rate and review wherever you listen to podcasts. You can join us on Patreon where we have some really cool things including extra stories from encounters episodes. Yeah,

fulllength bonus episodes, witch class, book club, campfire stories, lots of things. So, join us over there. And thank you to our editor and producer Jamie Ryan and our producer Emma Leventter. We love you all and we love you for listening. Thank you. We love you

and we will see

see you on the other side. Very spooky.